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List:       kde-devel
Subject:    Re: KSysGuard renaming
From:       "Aaron J. Seigo" <aseigo () kde ! org>
Date:       2006-06-07 4:52:53
Message-ID: 200606062253.00082.aseigo () kde ! org
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On Tuesday 06 June 2006 21:29, Greg Martyn wrote:
> On Tuesday 06 June 2006 12:46 pm, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > my experience with users on IRC says it gives no real advantage. this
> > rename is mostly change for change's sake; one -still- has to know:
> >
> >  - it's a kde app
> >  - it's called "system monitor" (not the first name that springs to my
> > mind, btw, it's a learned thing)
> >  - that it needs to get started
>
> What is the first thing that you think of?

when i said i hope this doesn't become a long discussion about naming i meant 
it. ;)

so i'm simply not going to discuss it ... that's how relevant i think it all 
is at this point.

> > what's bad here is that we now have a new style of names that doesn't
> > mesh with anything else.
>
> It meshes very will with that other desktop environment that 1-2 (maybe
> more? :) people have installed on their computers. Type gnome-[tab][tab] in

let me clarify: anything kde. if everything in kde switches to some new scheme 
then fine. but lets not make kde inconsistent with itself. that's just common 
sense.

> professional. If it's just a matter of flipping some names, then I don't
> mind doing it. I've learned a thing or two from this debacle, and think
> that if done right, it could be done by one motivated person.

you bet it could. but the way to do it is not one app out of the blue. in 
fact, that's precisely the -wrong- way to do it. it should be done globally 
or not at all. and if done globally it should be discussed on kde-core-devel. 
and in a thread away from ksysguard. ;)

> > to be perfectly honest, i'm personally highly skeptical of ksysguard in
> > general. (that's not the same as saying i'm skeptical of your abilities,
> > which i'm not.)
>
> Me too. I'm working on it simply because I hate so much about it. Well, let
> me put that differently: I see so much potential for it. It is a fantastic
> foundation to build on, but it was abandoned before it was done. It has a
> ton of problems that have just been languishing until John, and later I,
> started hacking on it.

that's what got me working on kicker. funny how that works.

> John and I are like starved dogs ready to take on UI complexity. We're
> bouncing ideas around, and will definitely be pushing some big improvements
> forward this summer. You don't have to worry about that.

may i suggest consulting with one of our usability people?

i'd also be interested in your thoughts on, should you care to offer them, my 
suggestion of having a separate and purpose-built UI for the workspace with 
sysguard moved to kdeadmin for hardcore usage.

i'm very concerned that we'll end up with one app intended for two audiences 
(desktop users and sys admins) that will let one, the other or both down. the 
good news is that desktop users need very little in the way of UI. they also 
need something that pops up in a moment's notice even under heavy load (which 
says to me "loaded and running in the background at startup). worst case is 
it should populate the actual dialog when called into action, but that should 
be nearly instant compared to launching a whole app.

> >-then- perhaps we can visit a renaming.
>
> The problem I see with waiting is that people will become more and more
> resistant to change as time passes.

not really. as long as it happens before 4.0

> When things break completely right now, 
> it's just business as usual; the dust settles and we move on. Hell, this is
> KDE 4. This is our chance to change whatever we feel needs fixing. This
> window is only open for so long though. Is it already closed?

no, you simply led with the wrong foot. it happens =)

-- 
Aaron J. Seigo
Undulate Your Wantonness
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA  EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43

Full time KDE developer sponsored by Trolltech (http://www.trolltech.com)

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