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List:       opensuse
Subject:    Re: [opensuse] systemd
From:       Larry Stotler <larrystotler () gmail ! com>
Date:       2017-07-15 7:20:41
Message-ID: CADwjxuQ1PTriYZbjF6+iuWTOSZa2b1o4x+-swQnUBSiLdS-xLA () mail ! gmail ! com
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On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 11:02 PM, David C. Rankin
<drankinatty@suddenlinkmail.com> wrote:
>   I think you identified the competing sides with laser-beam precision.
> Intelligence is not wisdom.
>   When you get those rare discussions on the deeper issue, (regardless of the
> diplomacy used) it's worth taking a moment to (try) and understand what is
> being said -- and why. It applies in all facets of life and if only there were
> a way to include that lesson as part of the standard curriculum -- this ole
> world would only be the better for it.
>   Whether the wisdom be about software design paradigms, civil responsibility,
> or each singular issue in between.
>   And... if it just also happens to have all the hallmarks for a good street
> fight where one side is being intellectually pummeled in a colorful way --
> that's just icing on the cake :)

Part of the problem with "progress" is that people are either forced
to accept it or forced to find ways around it.  The systemd devs have
created a great many tools that some people find useful(avahi,
pulseaudio, etc) but which others do not.  I personally don't find any
value in them, but I don't care if others use them(semantic desktop
anyone??).  I just prefer to be able to not have them installed.  I
remember when I once tried to remove avahi from an openSUSE install
years ago, and it basically would have broken everything.  However, a
fresh install with it tabooed worked just fine.

Linux is a great tool, but as with any tool, it has it's uses.  When a
change is made, it can have a positive or negative benefit depending
on the user.  I personally didn't move to KDE4 even when I was told to
"get over it and get with the times".  Fortunately for me, I have the
ability to install and use TDE instead, which serves my desktop
purposes.  Unfortunately, systemd has basically become a dependency on
installation for so many things that it's not like a choice between
Desktop environments or editors(vi vs emacs - I use neither - Midnight
Commanders built-in editor does what I need).   And while I have made
use of susestudio, it's lagging behind as has been pointed out before.

While I personally don't really care for the philosophy of systemd, I
can make use of it.  Honestly my biggest issue is with Firefox.  Once
again earlier I had to kill it because it was hogging all the
resources of my laptop and I could barely do anything with it.
Desktop Environments  have become less important since so much is now
done on-line in a browser anyway.

In the almost 20 years I have used Linux, and I've used S.u.S.E. and
it's descendants for most of it, the biggest issue I've always ran
into was dependency hell.  Trying to figure out why something needs
something else(when it really shouldn't) used to drive me nuts.
Especially before I had high speed net access.

In the long run, it's up to each person to decide if the changes
implemented by the project leaders(who can't please everybody) are a
deal breaker or not.  Resources are far from infinite and IMNSHO
Linux's biggest problem is fragmentation more than anything else.
With Windows or Mac OS, you have 1 OS and several versions to choice
from.  With Linux, you have hundreds of distros and many versions of
each.  You even have dozens of BSDs to chose from.  Projects like the
Linux Standard Base and others tried to make things more uniform, but
even then you have .deb vs .rpm and so much more.

Sometimes too much choice is worse than having basically no choice at
all.  People are stubborn and will support their choice no matter what
anyone says.

To each their own.

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