[prev in list] [next in list] [prev in thread] [next in thread] 

List:       kde-usability
Subject:    Re: Kicker bar maiming
From:       Sander Devrieze <s.devrieze () pandora ! be>
Date:       2003-12-27 7:19:33
[Download RAW message or body]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Op zaterdag 27 december 2003 01:35, schreef Troels Tolstrup:
> On Saturday 27 December 2003 00:14, Sander Devrieze wrote:
> > > * The user don't really know what functionality she wants. Will I use
> > > konsole often? What is Konqueror and will I use it? Will I need to use
> > > the configuration functionality often?
> >
> > I agree: big changes in KPersonalizer are necessary.
>
> They can simply add or remove icons from kicker,

Removing maybe (but even then a interactive tutorial will be a good idea) but 
adding not: do new users know which applications are availible in KDE, do 
they know they can copy them from the K-Menu, do they know what the function 
of each application is, have they ever used a computer before,...?

> i even think this is way
> easier than finding and using KPersonalizer. Perhaps make a way to add and
> remove icons from kicker from within its kcm if worried about people
> figuring out that they need to right click on kicker.

Yes: these optional steps could be also integrated in KControl and 
KPersonalizer together.

> Besides, i can't see why you want to force them to make these kinds of
> decisions. Each time you force the user to choose you are making his life
> harder. He should be able to make the choice if he wants to, but you don't
> have to ram it down his throat.

Therefore I changed my idea to be an *optional* step in KPersonalizer: the 
user may choose by his own if he wants this or not.

> I think we should be *very* picky when
> choosing what to ask the user.

Yes, to me, nearly all steps might become optional steps :)

> In my oppinion, asking the user which icons
> he wants on kicker is a total waste of his time.
>
> > > Kicker's interface is not difficult to use and if it is, that is a very
> > > serious issue. Saying it is a punsishment (roughly) having to configure
> > > using the kicker is quite ridiculus, it is not a punishment or means
> > > more work than it means to have KPersonalizer and Kicker combined.
> >
> > I mentioned it already before (not with the following words of course):
> > It isn't comfortable if people need to choose the parts of their meal in
> > different times: that's why a waiter/waitress gives you the menu *when
> > you enter* the restaurant.
>
> KDEs menu card is freaking long, if you expect people to "read" it before
> they can enter, then i seriously doubt you will get a single customer. I
> know that i would leave.

As in a restaurant, you don't need to read everything.

> I find this analogy is silly anyway. As far as i see it, KDE should not
> have to be configured initially, but be setup so as many people as possible
> can use it, and then make it so those who feel that some things should
> change can change them. This is what i hate the most about kpersonalizer, i
> really don't believe that people new to kde will have a freaking clue what
> to choose in it, and once you do have a clue about it, you do no longer
> need a wizard to change those things.

Yes, KPersonalizer needs some changes.

> > When people have to choose after every course
> > the next course their conversation will be everytime interrupted. The
> > same applies to KDE: if people need to configure things when they
> > remember that they need to do it, their work will be everytime
> > interrupted
>
> And this is worse than having to spend 3 years choosing things before you
> can even start working? I'm sorry, but i think you got it completely
> backwards.

*Optional* steps... :s

> > (or they feel bad because it hinders them and they don't have
> > the courage/time to change it at that time).
>
> And again, why do you think kpersonalizer changes this? It asks the user a
> lot of questions that are hard to answer without knowing KDE already, i
> think a very natural reaction to try to exit the wizard.

Because they don't click it away when KPersonalizer is changed :)

> > > You can also look at it from another perspective:
> > > Do you agree that removing the konsole button is a good thing?
> >
> > No, I only agree that it isn't necessary for some usergroup while there
> > are usergroups for which it's important.
>
> And again, you don't think that the group who needs it can spare the 5
> seconds it takes to add it back? (It is still my belief that those who use
> it that much can figure out how to put it back, while those not using it
> might not be able to figure out how to get rid of it)

" It isn't comfortable if people need to choose the parts of their meal in 
different times: that's why a waiter/waitress gives you the menu *when you 
enter* the restaurant."

> This is not GNOME, but i think a default gnome setup is pretty darn good.
> What i can't stand about it, is that they took away the power to customize
> the interface. But a think a very clean default install is a very good base
> for all types of users, both basic and advanced users, as it is easy to
> start with, and easy to build upon.

- -- 
Mvg, Sander Devrieze.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (GNU/Linux)

iD8DBQE/7TKMK+G8aHNHCSMRAl+vAKCSN1TkAAICMF/k5hg9NrUQVaCJaQCeJgZ0
89Uk6vl3oyTKfiIQFV7VznQ=
=tsm4
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

_______________________________________________
kde-usability mailing list
kde-usability@mail.kde.org
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-usability

[prev in list] [next in list] [prev in thread] [next in thread]