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List:       kde-panel-devel
Subject:    Minutes Monday Plasma Hangout
From:       Sebastian =?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=BCgler?= <sebas () kde ! org>
Date:       2017-09-25 11:13:41
Message-ID: 11863953.I1f6gz2rkr () miro
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Meeting minutes!
-- 
sebas

http://www.kde.org | http://vizZzion.org

Plasma Meeting 25-09-2017

Present: jensreut, Sho_, kbroulik, fvogt, Riddell, d_ed, bshah, sebas

jensreut:
* VDG management

Sho:
* Did emergency v1.0.3 release of Simple Menu to fix favorites on Plasma v5.11
* On vacation last week but did a massive amount of coding on Konversation -> \
                https://userbase.kde.org/Konversation/Konvi2x#Work_log
* QtWS coordination

d_ed:
* new plasma beta release, everything is broken
* redid the way QQC2 style is set, it's now not polluting other dev's envs
* Fixed global menu and autohide
* A KWayland race condition (fixed it potentially crashing the server, then changed \
                it so that state wouldn't happen anyway)
* Changed the kscreen auto scaling to not try to autoscale projectors or virtual \
screens (where DPI can't be calculated)


Riddell:
* 10 days until 5.11 tars are made!
* Qt 5.10 alpha now available in neon

fvogt:
- has nothing to report (but I saw him helping to debug screen scaling problems, so \
he's probably lieing ;-))

bshah:
- Arch linux images
    - Spend half of week debugging why I can't mount /firmware partition
    - Turns out it is the selinux context= option in fstab, which is not recognized \
                by mount becuase coreutils is not built with selinux support
- Halium
    - investigated a libybris build failure with glibc 2.26
    - only to realize it was fixed by someone else already : \
https://github.com/libhybris/libhybris/commit/9128c0ac80ff713b3b45

sebas:
- debugged and fixed https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=384733 (fixes went into \
                three different repos, which makes it seriously hairy stuff)
- regression caused by one of the above patches, also fixed and confirmed
- wrote privacy software goal https://phabricator.kde.org/T7050 (please put your name \
                under it!)
- Blogged about history of Plasma Mobile \
                https://vizzzion.org/blog/2017/09/the-evolution-of-plasma-mobile/
- Wrote another blog about convergence (will publish tomorrow I guess, want to \
include AlexL's concept X as possible direction there)




The Log:

[12:04:03] <sebas> Meeting time!
[12:04:11] <sebas> Who's here for that?
[12:04:36] <jensreut> Im here but have almost zero plasma stuff to support
[12:04:52] <Sho_> here too
[12:05:06] <jensreut> bshah: is at dentist
[12:05:14] <jensreut> (I think he said)
[12:05:50] -*- fvogt too, with nothing to report
[12:06:04] <kbroulik> meeting
[12:06:14] <kbroulik> (I just felt like Internet Explorer)
[12:06:37] <sebas> Alright, then jens reports his almost zero stuff, then Sho, then \
kbroulik [12:06:48] <sebas> I'll finish and we go our merry ways
[12:07:06] <-- agurenko (~agurenko@83.220.237.58) has quit (Ping timeout: 252 \
seconds) [12:07:07] --> fekepp1 (~Thunderbi@2a00:1398:9:fb00:863a:4bff:fe10:5650) has \
joined #plasma [12:07:23] <jensreut> Almost Zero about Plasma: VDG 2.0 planning \
puttering along. Will start setting up talks about it in the private VDG channel \
[12:07:37] <jensreut> Almost Zero about Plasma: done. [12:07:55] <Sho_> Eike Hein:
[12:07:56] <Sho_> * Did emergency v1.0.3 release of Simple Menu to fix favorites on \
Plasma v5.11 [12:07:56] <Sho_> * On vacation last week but did a massive amount of \
coding on Konversation -> https://userbase.kde.org/Konversation/Konvi2x#Work_log \
[12:07:56] <Sho_> * QtWS coordination [12:08:13] <jensreut> Oh it also means that if \
you're not a designer, you wont be in the VDG private room come tomorrow (addendum to \
almost zero) [12:08:23] <Sho_> heh, the name header is because I copied it from \
Telegram which I used as notepad [12:08:48] <-- fekepp \
(~Thunderbi@2a00:1398:200:200:863a:4bff:fe10:5650) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 \
seconds) [12:08:49] <-> fekepp1 is now known as fekepp
[12:09:00] <Sho_> Oh and Marco is absent I can report on some Kirigami stuff related \
to the Konvi work [12:09:34] <Sho_> Konversation's design as well as other VDG \
designs contain a UI area that is dark or inverse-colored [12:10:07] <Sho_> we've \
been teaching Kirigami how to do that, using sort of a on-steroids version of \
Plasma's old ColorScope [12:10:34] <Sho_> it's much more sophisticated and \
performant, and repalettes and recolors icons niftily across platforms and styles \
[12:10:49] <Sho_> Marco worked his butt off there [12:11:02] <sebas> yeah awesome!
[12:11:05] <Sho_> and that's it from my side :)
[12:11:13] <sebas> Also, cool konvi stuff (was about to ask, I'll check on that \
then!) [12:11:42] <Sho_> I will do a cool progress blog report with animations \
sometime this week I hope [12:11:42] <sebas> jensreut: what's the reason to have \
private conversations, shouldn't it be open by default as to make it easier for \
others to follow and join in? [12:11:47] <sebas> Sho_: nice
[12:12:06] <Sho_> (Plasma and QtWS permitting :)
[12:12:30] <Sho_> But yeah it was probably my most productive week this year ... on \
vacation ;) [12:12:43] <jensreut> No. this is about internal organisation and I want \
to know their issues and I dont want your feedback to begin with. The VDG private \
channel was never ment for design work and external communication - but the \
"nonsense" and "blowing off steam" that is now happening in individual chats making \
it even less effective. [12:12:56] <jensreut> "Dont want your feedback IN THE \
BEGINNING" sry english [12:13:35] <sebas> Aye, I get that ... didn't know you had \
"blowing off steam", where does that come from? [12:13:49] <jensreut> day to day work \
:) [12:14:25] <sebas> I meant which kind of people blow off steam?
[12:14:41] <jensreut> Sometimes someone will go "I hate all programmers" and that is \
not ment as feedback to programmers but when you're frustrated. I want to make sure \
that no one thins that that is anything more than "Ouch I stupped my toe" screaming. \
[12:14:43] <sebas> is that you designer guys needing a place to vent, or others \
complaining about you, or yet something else? [12:15:01] <sebas> (Seems like an \
unhealthy thing, so I'd like to know more about it, perhaps we can do something about \
it as well...) [12:15:03] <jensreut> Us, if its someone else that should be in the \
public channel [12:15:23] <sebas> haha, okay. You're allowed to hate all programmers \
:D [12:15:26] <jensreut> heh now it sounds really dramatic... :D
[12:15:28] <-- guoyunhe (~sign@dsl-hkibng11-50dcc9-195.dhcp.inet.fi) has quit (Ping \
timeout: 240 seconds) [12:15:39] <sebas> nah, that's normal
[12:16:16] <jensreut> It HAS happened that something was really frustrating and \
someone goes "aaaau7uurrurgggh!" and I just want to have that contained and also part \
of smaller discussions that doesnt concern actual design projects. Separate the two \
for now. They have been too mixed up [12:17:12] <jensreut> (also no one hates all \
programmers... MOST programmers, we hate "most programmers" ;) ) [12:17:24] <sebas> \
gheghe [12:17:27] <sebas> alright, cool :)
[12:17:32] <sebas> thanks for handling that
[12:17:56] <jensreut> I just want to say it here so no one thinks I am moving them \
out of the group for some horrible reason. Its for now... [12:18:26] <sebas> nope, \
got it [12:18:32] <jensreut> <3
[12:19:03] <sebas> kbroulik:
[12:19:08] <kbroulik> * Some fixes and minor performance improvements here and there
[12:19:08] <sebas> your turn
[12:19:12] <kbroulik> We've got a new very eager contributor (in Dolphin and kde apps \
mostly but still) https://phabricator.kde.org/p/ngraham/ so please have a look at \
some of his review requests and make him feel welcome :) [12:19:15] <kbroulik> that's \
it from me [12:20:09] <d_ed> jensreut: quite a few of those need VDG input ^. you \
guys are tagged in them [12:20:26] <Riddell> 10 days until 5.11 tars are made!
[12:20:32] <Riddell> Sho_: did you update the release announce?
[12:20:42] <jensreut> kbroulik: he is probably already on board (we have him pegged \
as future VDG bugwrangler) [12:20:57] <fvogt> ngraham, isn't that PointiestStick on \
reddit, the gui who made looong posts with complaints in the beginning? [12:21:04] \
<fvogt> s/gui/guy/... [12:21:14] <jensreut> Yup
[12:21:16] <d_ed> fvogt: I believe so
[12:21:22] <Sho_> Riddell: argh, I forgot because of the power outage and now I'm not \
at a system with ssh keys. when is the release? [12:21:31] <sebas> d_ed: your turn \
:-) [12:21:38] <Sho_> oh, you just said
[12:21:47] <Riddell> Sho_: I refer the honourable gentleman to the comments I made \
some momets ago [12:21:52] <Sho_> Riddell: will edit tmrw, promised!
[12:22:13] <d_ed> new release, everything is broken
[12:22:14] -*- Sho_ writes big todo note
[12:22:16] <Riddell> but translators will want it pronto
[12:22:23] <-- Son_Goku (~King_InuY@fedora/ngompa) has quit (Quit: My MacBook has \
gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) [12:22:31] <d_ed> redid the way QQC2 style is set, it's now \
not polluting other dev's envs [12:22:38] <sebas> fvogt: I'll put this in the notes \
for you:  "- has nothing to report (but I saw him helping to debug screen scaling \
problems, so he's probably lieing ;-))" [12:22:49] <Sho_> Riddell: if tomorrow is too \
late, should I send you notes now? [12:22:55] <-- Haudegen (~quassel@178.115.237.87) \
has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [12:22:56] <Sho_> (sorry David)
[12:22:59] <-- nowrep (~david@kde/developer/drosca) has quit (Quit: Konversation \
terminated!) [12:23:09] <sebas> d_ed: new release of ...? (Plasma Beta?)
[12:23:15] <d_ed> Plasma
[12:23:26] --> TheKit (~nekit@85.143.20.2) has joined #plasma
[12:23:35] --> freeman42y (~freeman42@37.228.231.78) has joined #plasma
[12:24:04] <d_ed> * Fixed global menu and autohide
[12:24:31] <d_ed> * A KWayland race condition (fixed it potentially crashing the \
server, then changed it so that state wouldn't happen anyway) [12:25:02] <d_ed> * \
Changed the kscreen auto scaling to not try to autoscale projectors or virtual \
screens (where DPI can't be calculated) [12:26:22] <d_ed> as we're in a meeting, does \
anyone have any opinions on the "new widgets to plasma" thread? Otherwise I'll \
probably end up helping incubate them [12:26:55] <Sho_> I'm opposed to the redshift \
one [12:27:07] <Sho_> It's redundant with Roman's night mode
[12:27:20] <sebas> from my POV, it seemed fine, but not terribly convinced of neither \
option [12:27:41] <Sho_> btw: shadeslayer has been telling me launcher favorites are \
borked on his odroid images with the beta but I have not been able to repro, testing \
appreciated [12:27:47] <Sho_> re release borkage
[12:27:48] <sebas> Sho_: Hm, it's complementary actually, Roman's stuff is wayland \
only, no? [12:27:56] <Sho_> (no bug reports for beta on it)
[12:28:02] <sebas> so we'd need a way to not show redshit on X
[12:28:08] <d_ed> sebas: currently it is, there's no reason it has to be
[12:28:14] <sebas> or have them merged with different backends
[12:28:29] --> nowrep (~david@kde/developer/drosca) has joined #plasma
[12:28:34] <Sho_> sebas: yeah, but do we really want to end up with a situation where \
we ship widget that's confusingly treading the same ground as other options in the \
UI? [12:28:37] <sebas> and it's an often requested feature I think, I'd actually be \
okay with plasma-addons [12:28:45] <sebas> nice way to incubate the dev as well...
[12:28:53] <d_ed> well he wants his own repo rather than into p-d/p-w
[12:29:05] <Sho_> oh
[12:29:12] <Sho_> that's totally fine ofc
[12:29:23] <Sho_> no reason they can't dev om kde
[12:29:30] <Sho_> *dev on kde.org
[12:29:46] <Sho_> I thought it was about release inclusion
[12:30:37] <sebas> should we continue that on the list then?
[12:31:06] <sebas> incubating into KDE is fine anyway, making it part of official \
Plasma is the question [12:31:17] <sebas> also touches the scope, how much will we \
keep adding... [12:31:42] <sebas> Anyway, Riddell: anything to report?
[12:31:53] <Riddell> Qt 5.10 alpha now available in neon
[12:32:00] <Riddell> I'll do a blog shortly
[12:32:14] <Riddell> kirigami stuff crashes as does the clock so anyone who can help \
on that would be good [12:32:35] <Riddell> and tars in 10 days for release in 15 days \
for 5.11 [12:32:36] <Riddell> is all
[12:32:39] <Sho_> Riddell: if editing the announcement tomorrow is too late, should I \
send notes now? [12:32:41] <sebas> ow, so for now I better not update my neon git \
unstable? [12:33:02] <Riddell> sebas: it's hidden in the secret testing/ repo so you \
won't get it unless you have that enabled for whatever reason [12:33:09] <sebas> \
okay, good :) [12:33:16] <Riddell> which only nutters like soee do
[12:33:21] <sebas> I often upgrade willy-nilly
[12:33:30] <sebas> (another kind of nutter)
[12:33:36] <Riddell> Sho_: if you have them sure I can do that and keep the \
translators happier [12:33:47] <d_ed> Riddell: can you explain "the clock crashes"
[12:34:21] <-- TheKit (~nekit@85.143.20.2) has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[12:35:01] <Riddell> d_ed: https://i.imgur.com/cpEY4Gw.jpg
[12:35:43] <Riddell> CalendarView unavailable
[12:37:02] <sebas> Let's debug this further post-meeting as to not hold the meeting \
up... [12:37:20] <sebas> my turn, and then go ahead...
[12:37:25] <sebas> - debugged and fixed https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=384733 \
(fixes went into three different repos, which makes it seriously hairy stuff) \
[12:37:25] <sebas> - regression caused by one of the above patches, also fixed and \
confirmed [12:37:25] <sebas> - wrote privacy software goal \
https://phabricator.kde.org/T7050 (please put your name under it!) [12:37:25] <sebas> \
- Blogged about history of Plasma Mobile \
https://vizzzion.org/blog/2017/09/the-evolution-of-plasma-mobile/ [12:37:25] <sebas> \
- Wrote another blog about convergence (will publish tomorrow I guess, want to \
include AlexL's concept X as possible direction there) [12:37:25] <sKreamer> KDE bug \
384733 in KScreen (kded) "Wayland configs are not saved" [normal,FIXED] \
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=384733 [12:37:25] <sKreamer> Task 7050 "Privacy \
Software" [Open,Normal] {Goal settings 2017} https://phabricator.kde.org/T7050 \
[12:37:49] <sebas> I think keeping Plasma Mobile visible is going quite well right \
now, fundraiser is still going fairly strong [12:37:56] <bshah> sebas: just came back \
from dentist.. [12:37:57] --> CrKit (~nekit@85.143.20.2) has joined #plasma
[12:38:07] <bshah> will send you notes in 10-15 mins later
[12:38:16] <bshah> (it's just two liner.. but still :p)
[12:38:17] <sebas> bshah: wb! if you want to report, you can go ahead now
[12:38:31] <bshah> need to write notes well..
[12:38:57] <bshah> but, I mostly debugged why I can't mount /firmware partition of \
android inside the archlinux rootfs [12:39:01] <bshah> and found issue this morning
[12:39:24] <bshah> 12:56 <bshah> turns  out it is selinux
[12:39:26] <bshah> 12:56 <bshah> it defines "context=foo" in the mount options
[12:39:28] <bshah> 12:57 <bshah> but in archlinux
[12:39:30] <bshah> 12:57 <bshah> coreutils is not compiled with selinux
[12:39:32] <bshah> 12:57 <bshah> so it fails to understand context= option
[12:39:34] <bshah> 12:58 <bshah> which is kinda stupid
[12:39:50] <bshah> and that's pretty much it from my side mostly
[12:40:01] <bshah> but I can send structured notes in bit
[12:40:36] <sebas> sure, send them to me in a query and I'll include them, then send \
it to the list [12:40:39] <sebas> otherwise, meeting done!
[12:41:24] <sebas> Would be nice if we could do this a little more actively focused \
next time around, 35 minutes bears room for improvements... Thanks those that \
participated though, much appreciated! [12:41:29] <sebas> meeting done!
[12:43:47] <sebas> librem 5 campaign is at 46.15% now, almost 700KUSD raised
[12:43:54] <-- preview (~quassel@2407:7000:842d:4000::3) has quit (Ping timeout: 246 \
seconds) [12:43:58] <sebas> https://puri.sm/shop/librem-5/
[12:44:03] <-- Delta-One (~zero@2001:6b0:2:2801:b8b7:edf2:d580:750b) has quit (Quit: \
Leaving) [12:44:45] <kbroulik> d_ed: I'll slam a "menu" button on the notifications \
preview to make the existence of the context menu more obvious. I'll put that in 5.11 \
(no new strings) since we havent figured out notification accessibility anyway \
[12:45:07] --> romangg (~roman@p20030006511A3B47D019AC8F58FCDF7C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) \
has joined #plasma [12:45:13] <bshah> sebas: about Plasma mobile blog, I had some \
more ideas about blogpost(s) which focus on "some" technical bits .. do you have some \
more blogposts or something in mind for promo? if so we can co-ordinate maybe? \
[12:45:47] <sebas> bshah: yes, one about convergence, which is more conceptual \
[12:46:13] <bshah> mostly I wanted to blog which is more like "What makes plasma \
mobile" [12:46:15] <sebas> planned for tomorrow (I haven't figured out how I can show \
previews from my WP) [12:46:28] <sebas> bshah: yeah, very cool! if you need \
proof-reading, hit me up!



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