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List: ubuntu-devel
Subject: Re: More diagnostics data from desktop
From: Will Cooke <will.cooke () canonical ! com>
Date: 2018-02-20 11:10:36
Message-ID: CACBNyqt4x-18VNpBAB92JYR8KkRv-0HMKEQJ49mm5Aa=x8gqTw () mail ! gmail ! com
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On 19 February 2018 at 13:55, Matthew Paul Thomas <mpt@canonical.com> wrote:
> Will Cooke wrote on 14/02/18 15:22:
> >…
> > We want to be able to focus our engineering efforts on the things that
> > matter most to our users, and in order to do that we need to get some
> > more data about sort of setups our users have and which software they
> > are running on it.
> >
> > We would like to add a checkbox to the installer, exact wording TBD,
> > but along the lines of "Send diagnostics information to help improve
> > Ubuntu". This would be checked by default.
>
> I've just drafted a design for this. <https://goo.gl/yJ86Qa> It's
> basically a subset of the System Settings screen.
>
Thanks, we will take a look at that, but on first scan it looks good.
> > The result of having that box checked would be:
> >
> > * Information from the installation would be sent over HTTPS to a
> > service run by Canonical's IS team. This would be saved to disk and
> > sent on first boot once there is a network connection.
>
> Information from the installation would be fascinating, for improvement
> of the installer in particular. However, I don't think it would give you
> an accurate idea about the "sort of setups our users have", for
> improvement of Ubuntu in general. It could lead you to think that, for
> example:
>
> * Internet connection is less common than it really is. (Because of
> things like proxies, as mentioned by Ernst Sjöstrand, or
> not-yet-installed wi-fi drivers. And because if people still can't
> get online later, they might uninstall Ubuntu and you'll never get
> a report.)
>
> * Wired Internet connections are more common than they really are.
> (Because they're being used temporarily during installation, while
> wi-fi isn't working.)
>
> * Typical screen resolution is lower than it really is. (Because
> people don't tweak the resolution until after installation. And
> because if they fail to do so, they might uninstall Ubuntu,
> resulting in a report for a system that soon stops existing.)
>
> * Bluetooth devices are much less common than they really are.
>
> I think it would be much more interesting to measure these things month
> by month.
>
>
Yes, general trending is what we're aiming for here. Thanks for the input
on those specifics.
> > The file
> > containing this data would be available for the user to inspect.
> >
> > That data would include:
> > * Ubuntu Flavour
> > * Ubuntu Version
> > * Network connectivity or not
>
> If I understand "on first boot once there is a network connection", that
> would exclude devices that were offline until the second startup or later.
>
>
We were thinking along the lines of something which would try to send the
data at login a number of times, let's say.... 10, and then give up. So if
the machine never comes on line, then the data never gets sent. If the
machine travels between various locations before arriving at a working
internet connection, then it should eventually be able to send it. I think
that would cover the vast majority of cases.
> > * CPU family
> > * RAM
> > * Disk(s) size
> > * Screen(s) resolution
> > * GPU vendor and model
> > * OEM Manufacturer
> > * Location (based on the location selection made by the user at
> > install). No IP information would be gathered
> > * Installation duration (time taken)
> > * Auto login enabled or not
> > * Disk layout selected
> > * Third party software selected or not
> > * Download updates during install or not
> > * LivePatch enabled or not
> >
> > * Popcon would be installed. This will allow us to spot trends in
> > package usage and help us to focus on the packages which are of most
> > value to our users.
>
> This effectively singles out .deb package installation as the only thing
> that should be reported periodically, with everything else reported
> one-off. Is that just for ease of implementation, or is there a reason
> not to report the other things periodically too?
>
Mainly ease of implementation.
>
> For example, if we could see how often people change their reported
> location, we'd have info on how accessible the time zone UI should be.
> And if it turns out that only a tiny fraction of Livepatch users turn it
> on during install, vs. afterwards, that would influence future installer
> design.
>
Wouldn't that involve us being able to track a person/machine to know when
it had been changed? Or would something in the location picker send a
signal? I don't like either of these options, I've probably misunderstood
the idea.
>
> >…
> > Any user can simply opt out by unchecking the box, which triggers one
> > simple POST stating, "diagnostics=false".
>
> What is the purpose of this?
>
To try and measure engagement rates. This would be important in the
"opt-in" case I think, how representative of users is the data? < 10% of
people are submitting data, then probably not very useful.
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/
> mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
>
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<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">On 19 February 2018 \
at 13:55, Matthew Paul Thomas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mpt@canonical.com" \
target="_blank">mpt@canonical.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc \
solid;padding-left:1ex">Will Cooke wrote on 14/02/18 15:22:<br> >…<br>
<span class="">> We want to be able to focus our engineering efforts on the things \
that<br> > matter most to our users, and in order to do that we need to get \
some<br> > more data about sort of setups our users have and which software \
they<br> > are running on it.<br>
><br>
> We would like to add a checkbox to the installer, exact wording TBD,<br>
> but along the lines of "Send diagnostics information to help improve<br>
> Ubuntu". This would be checked by default.<br>
<br>
</span>I've just drafted a design for this. <<a href="https://goo.gl/yJ86Qa" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://goo.gl/yJ86Qa</a>> It's<br> basically a \
subset of the System Settings \
screen.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks, we will take a \
look at that, but on first scan it looks good.</div><div> </div><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc \
solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=""> > The result of having that box checked \
would be:<br> ><br>
> * Information from the installation would be sent over HTTPS to a<br>
> service run by Canonical's IS team. This would be saved to disk and<br>
> sent on first boot once there is a network connection.<br>
<br>
</span>Information from the installation would be fascinating, for improvement<br>
of the installer in particular. However, I don't think it would give you<br>
an accurate idea about the "sort of setups our users have", for<br>
improvement of Ubuntu in general. It could lead you to think that, for<br>
example:<br>
<br>
* Internet connection is less common than it really is. (Because of<br>
things like proxies, as mentioned by Ernst Sjöstrand, or<br>
not-yet-installed wi-fi drivers. And because if people still can't<br>
get online later, they might uninstall Ubuntu and you'll never get<br>
a report.)<br>
<br>
* Wired Internet connections are more common than they really are.<br>
(Because they're being used temporarily during installation, while<br>
wi-fi isn't working.)<br>
<br>
* Typical screen resolution is lower than it really is. (Because<br>
people don't tweak the resolution until after installation. And<br>
because if they fail to do so, they might uninstall Ubuntu,<br>
resulting in a report for a system that soon stops existing.)<br>
<br>
* Bluetooth devices are much less common than they really are.<br>
<br>
I think it would be much more interesting to measure these things month<br>
by month.<br>
<span class=""><br></span></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Yes, general trending is \
what we're aiming for here. Thanks for the input on those \
specifics.</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=""> \
> \
The file<br> > containing this data would be available for the user to \
inspect.<br> ><br>
> That data would include:<br>
> * Ubuntu Flavour<br>
> * Ubuntu Version<br>
> * Network connectivity or not<br>
<br>
</span>If I understand "on first boot once there is a network connection", that<br>
would exclude devices that were offline until the second startup or later.<br>
<span class=""><br></span></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>We were \
thinking along the lines of something which would try to send the data at login a \
number of times, let's say.... 10, and then give up. So if the machine never \
comes on line, then the data never gets sent. If the machine travels between \
various locations before arriving at a working internet connection, then it should \
eventually be able to send it. I think that would cover the vast majority of \
cases.</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class=""> \
> * CPU family<br> > * RAM<br>
> * Disk(s) size<br>
> * Screen(s) resolution<br>
> * GPU vendor and model<br>
> * OEM Manufacturer<br>
> * Location (based on the location selection made by the user at<br>
> install). No IP information would be gathered<br>
> * Installation duration (time taken)<br>
> * Auto login enabled or not<br>
> * Disk layout selected<br>
> * Third party software selected or not<br>
> * Download updates during install or not<br>
> * LivePatch enabled or not<br>
><br>
> * Popcon would be installed. This will allow us to spot trends in<br>
> package usage and help us to focus on the packages which are of most<br>
> value to our users.<br>
<br>
</span>This effectively singles out .deb package installation as the only thing<br>
that should be reported periodically, with everything else reported<br>
one-off. Is that just for ease of implementation, or is there a reason<br>
not to report the other things periodically \
too?<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Mainly ease of \
implementation.</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> <br>
For example, if we could see how often people change their reported<br>
location, we'd have info on how accessible the time zone UI should be.<br>
And if it turns out that only a tiny fraction of Livepatch users turn it<br>
on during install, vs. afterwards, that would influence future installer<br>
design.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Wouldn't that involve us being able \
to track a person/machine to know when it had been changed? Or would something in \
the location picker send a signal? I don't like either of these options, \
I've probably misunderstood the idea.</div><div><br></div><div> \
<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px \
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> <br>
>…<br>
<span class="">> Any user can simply opt out by unchecking the box, which triggers \
one<br> > simple POST stating, "diagnostics=false".<br>
<br>
</span>What is the purpose of \
this?<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>To try and measure \
engagement rates. This would be important in the "opt-in" case I think, \
how representative of users is the data? < 10% of people are submitting data, \
then probably not very useful.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div \
class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5">Modify settings or unsubscribe at: <a \
href="https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://lists.ubuntu.com/<wbr>mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel</a><br> \
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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