[prev in list] [next in list] [prev in thread] [next in thread]
List: koffice-devel
Subject: Re: koffice
From: Pierre Stirnweiss <pstirnweiss () googlemail ! com>
Date: 2011-02-02 16:34:26
Message-ID: AANLkTi=6Z37JkSgrwZhLi_fZQpmDQzvf+vgLHCPTaxcd () mail ! gmail ! com
[Download RAW message or body]
[Attachment #2 (multipart/alternative)]
On Wed, Feb 2, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Aaron J. Seigo <aseigo@kde.org> wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 2, 2011, Pierre Stirnweiss wrote:
> > The statement "KOffice is a brand name that has precisely zero "real
> world"
> > value" is actually expressing your own point of view
>
> show me who would buy it for any significant price due to its value as an
> office suite brand. this isn't a mere "point of view", it's a cold fact.
> you
> can wish it to be otherwise, as a way to justify the large amount of
> valuable
> energy and time you've thrown into this current fight, but that doesn't
> change
> reality.
>
Well, I have to say I can't beleive I hear this argument from you. An FSOSS
project, or even name would be worth only the amount of money somebody is
willing to spend on it? How many years was the name/project Linux worthless
with this standard? And what about Plasma then, I for one am very very glad
that some people had found a real world value other than what people would
have been willing to spend moneywise on it at its infancy. Weren't there
people (distro?) actually spending money on trying to negate it?
There would actually be way fewer new projects even started in FSOSS, if the
only "real" value of these would be measured in "money" or "return on
investment".
And even all this is irrelevant: who is to judge what is the "reality" of
the value "KOffice" has? On what standard?
>
> and yes, i know you have put emotional value into "KOffice" as a name. in
> part
> it's because you have all fought so much about so many things that you are
> clinging so dearly to this name, if even just as a symbol. but what would
> you
> do with it once you've got it? feel smugly proud that you won something
> that
> nobody else cares about, that has no practical use, and all at the expense
> of
> the health of your community? in exchange for time and energy that you will
> never get back? is that a trade you are willing to make? is that a trade
> you
> can afford to make?
>
I am not advocating a fight over the name. I personnaly actually don't care,
however I came way later than others in that project.
What I do care about is that you are basically saying: all the effort you
put in what was KOffice, all the emotional relation you have with this is
worthless. Nobody cares about it, now go and spend more of your free time on
what "users" want.
What I do challenge is the assertion you make saying that people fighting
over KOffice name is just for their own petty interrest in victory over the
"ennemy" camp.
> and is this what you envision for Calligra? does it embody the spririt of
> Calligra as you want it to be? are you actually building Calligra up, or is
> this a major distraction to that?
>
> iow, what are your priorities?
>
> keep in mind that there are opportunities that exist right now for Calligra
> which won't last forever. they are slowly slipping into the past while you
> spend precious resources on this emotional drama.
>
Would you have said: "people, what KOffice was for you is no more. Try to
move on. You have better things to spend your energy on, than things which
are no more". I would have given you a +1.
>
> > Sorry but the emotional
> > value I give to something is as "real world" as any other's value.
>
> a drug addict values his drugs. it doesn't justify the value he puts in the
> drugs nor does it make the drugs good for him. people can, and do, misplace
> value in things.
>
Sorry but taking extreme examples are not making a point. You can't compare
the value people are putting in the FSOSS project they participate on with
the one drug adicts put into its drugs.
> you are risking the future health of your project. you are wasting energy
> that
> could be plowed into making your projects into the best apps in f/oss,
> instead
> putting that energy into a hole where you can never get it back. you are
> chasing people away from your project at a moment when there is/was a good
> amount of positivity being built up around it.
>
> you are trading things of value for things of pain.
>
>
This I agree with. This is not what I read in your first post. What I read
is "what you have spend such amount of energy and emotions on is worthless
and represents nothing". Not "is no more" or "is in the past", but actually
"has no real value".
Pierre
[Attachment #5 (text/html)]
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Feb 2, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Aaron J. Seigo <span \
dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:aseigo@kde.org">aseigo@kde.org</a>></span> \
wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; \
border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> <div class="im">On \
Wednesday, February 2, 2011, Pierre Stirnweiss wrote:<br> > The statement \
"KOffice is a brand name that has precisely zero "real world"<br> > \
value" is actually expressing your own point of view<br> <br>
</div>show me who would buy it for any significant price due to its value as an<br>
office suite brand. this isn't a mere "point of view", it's a cold \
fact. you<br> can wish it to be otherwise, as a way to justify the large amount of \
valuable<br> energy and time you've thrown into this current fight, but that \
doesn't change<br> reality.<br></blockquote><div><br>Well, I have to say I \
can't beleive I hear this argument from you. An FSOSS project, or even name would \
be worth only the amount of money somebody is willing to spend on it? How many years \
was the name/project Linux worthless with this standard? And what about Plasma then, \
I for one am very very glad that some people had found a real world value other than \
what people would have been willing to spend moneywise on it at its infancy. \
Weren't there people (distro?) actually spending money on trying to negate \
it?<br> There would actually be way fewer new projects even started in FSOSS, if the \
only "real" value of these would be measured in "money" or \
"return on investment".<br><br>And even all this is irrelevant: who is to \
judge what is the "reality" of the value "KOffice" has? On what \
standard?<br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt \
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> <br>
and yes, i know you have put emotional value into "KOffice" as a name. in \
part<br> it's because you have all fought so much about so many things that you \
are<br> clinging so dearly to this name, if even just as a symbol. but what would \
you<br> do with it once you've got it? feel smugly proud that you won something \
that<br> nobody else cares about, that has no practical use, and all at the expense \
of<br> the health of your community? in exchange for time and energy that you \
will<br> never get back? is that a trade you are willing to make? is that a trade \
you<br> can afford to make?<br></blockquote><div><br>I am not advocating a fight over \
the name. I personnaly actually don't care, however I came way later than others \
in that project.<br>What I do care about is that you are basically saying: all the \
effort you put in what was KOffice, all the emotional relation you have with this is \
worthless. Nobody cares about it, now go and spend more of your free time on what \
"users" want.<br> What I do challenge is the assertion you make saying that \
people fighting over KOffice name is just for their own petty interrest in victory \
over the "ennemy" camp.<br><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); \
padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
and is this what you envision for Calligra? does it embody the spririt of<br>
Calligra as you want it to be? are you actually building Calligra up, or is<br>
this a major distraction to that?<br>
<br>
iow, what are your priorities?<br>
<br>
keep in mind that there are opportunities that exist right now for Calligra<br>
which won't last forever. they are slowly slipping into the past while you<br>
spend precious resources on this emotional drama.<br></blockquote><div><br>Would you \
have said: "people, what KOffice was for you is no more. Try to move on. You \
have better things to spend your energy on, than things which are no more". I \
would have given you a +1.<br> <br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); \
padding-left: 1ex;"> <div class="im"><br>
> Sorry but the emotional<br>
> value I give to something is as "real world" as any other's \
value.<br> <br>
</div>a drug addict values his drugs. it doesn't justify the value he puts in \
the<br> drugs nor does it make the drugs good for him. people can, and do, \
misplace<br> value in things.<br></blockquote><div><br>Sorry but taking extreme \
examples are not making a point. You can't compare the value people are putting \
in the FSOSS project they participate on with the one drug adicts put into its \
drugs.<br> </div><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt \
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"> <br>
you are risking the future health of your project. you are wasting energy that<br>
could be plowed into making your projects into the best apps in f/oss, instead<br>
putting that energy into a hole where you can never get it back. you are<br>
chasing people away from your project at a moment when there is/was a good<br>
amount of positivity being built up around it.<br>
<br>
you are trading things of value for things of pain.<br>
<div><div></div><br></div></blockquote></div><br>This I agree with. This is not what \
I read in your first post. What I read is "what you have spend such amount of \
energy and emotions on is worthless and represents nothing". Not "is no \
more" or "is in the past", but actually "has no real \
value".<br> <br><br>Pierre<br>
_______________________________________________
koffice-devel mailing list
koffice-devel@kde.org
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/koffice-devel
[prev in list] [next in list] [prev in thread] [next in thread]
Configure |
About |
News |
Add a list |
Sponsored by KoreLogic