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List:       kde-usability
Subject:    Re: Tabbed browsing vs taskbar grouping; a proposal.
From:       "Jamethiel Knorth" <jamethknorth () hotmail ! com>
Date:       2004-03-01 18:05:07
Message-ID: BAY7-F105P7UhzPF6IT000288d8 () hotmail ! com
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>From: Maurizio Colucci <seguso.forever@tin.it>
>Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:26:52 +0100
>
>On Sunday 29 February 2004 23:58, Mikolaj Machowski wrote:
> > Dnia Sunday 29 of February 2004 22:31, Maurizio Colucci napisał:
> > > > > It is common for me to have many konqueror instances open at once,
> > > > > each one in a different directory. I find this is useful because I
> > > > > have some dirs I use very often: it is quicker to leave them 
>always
> > > > > open than to find them each time. The same goes for konsoles
> > > > > instances.
> > > >
> > > > Why don't use bookmarks?
> > >
> > > This is a good suggestion. Unfortunately, 1) the approach is less
> > > dynamic. I am forced to choose the dirs beforehand, which should not 
>be
> > > necessary.
> > >
> > > Furthermore, there are small annoyances with the KDE implementation: 
>2)
> > > KDE truncates the names like this:
> > >
> > >   "/usr/local/bb...dfdfd/fdfd"
> > >
> > > which is unnerving to browse. This forces me to assign short names to 
>the
> > > bookmarks.
> >
> > But what if files have the same name?
>
>I don't see your point, since I am suggesting to show full paths.

Full paths take up too much space. That can't be done.

> > When working on different versions
> > of the same file-tree? Suppose this is the case, KDE-velopers are often
> > working on the various versions of the same file-trees and truncating
> > the names in this way is the best solution for them.
> >
> > OK. Konq (and all tab-enabled apps) should show last part of path and
> > if file with the same name but in another location is bookmarked it
> > should appear like "filename (2)".
> >
> > > 3) the bookmarks appear intermixed with the internet ones,
> > > which makes me scan many more items than the simple list of 
>directories.
> >
> > "Everything is URI". Personally I like this approach.
> >
> > > 4) there are the four special items: add bookmark, bookamrk tabs as
> > > folder, etc.
> >
> > And?
>
>You have to skip them with the mouse, because they appear on top of the 
>menu.

The options need to exist. Where are you proposing to put them?

> > > > > 1) BAD ASPECT OF OPENING DIRECTORIES IN TABS
> > > > > =========================================
> > > > >
> > > > > The problem of opening directories in tabs instead of new windows 
>is
> > > > > obvious: the full pathname doesn't fit in the tab. So, when you 
>want
> > > > > to find a particular dir, you end up pressing all tabs 
>sequentially,
> > > > > until you find it.
> > > >
> > > > Partial solution: tooltips for tabs.
> > >
> > > This is also a non-solution, because it is very unnerving to wait for 
>the
> > > tooltip to appear.
> >
> > And this is another cause for drastic shortening of time to show
> > tooltip (another one: in Relevantive usability study, users didn't use
> > tooltips because delay was too long).
>
>Wait: what if we show full paths in tabs, with line wrap (without breaking
>words)?
>
>    /mnt/hard-disk2/moved-from-
>    root-due-to-lack-of-space/
>    downloads
>
>
>This would IMO solve every problem, making tabs actually usable. A bit 
>taller,
>but so what?

That is one of the single most hideous ideas I have ever heard. It wastes my 
precious desktop real estate, makes the tab bar look like an abomination 
before god and man, likely requires the tab code to be altered, as there are 
currently never multi-line tabs. makes the buttons on the ends get dwarfed, 
and leaves the tab-bar size jumping around as directories change, resulting 
in constant resizing of the content window.

> >
> > > > > No sane person would do that. :-) So, as far as I
> > > > > understand, nobody would ever choose to open a new directory in a 
>new
> > > > > tab (unless his panel does not offer taskbar grouping).
> > > > >
> > > > > Notice this problem is not so dramatic when browsing the web: the
> > > > > page titles are rarely very long, and they often have a different
> > > > > icon. The problem is only serious when browsing the disk.
> > > >
> > > > Also you can use .directory file with Icon entry...
> > > > [Desktop Entry]
> > > > Icon=/usr/local/kde/share/icons/crystalsvg/16x16/actions/exec.png
> > >
> > > If you mean assign an icon to directories, well, I don't want to do 
>this
> > > by hand.
> >
> > Ha. I should use mouse, not Vim ;) RMB click on dir, Properties, click
> > icon, choose icon and everything works (don't know why not when doing it
> > in terminal).
> >
> > > OTOH, if the system were to assign icons automatically, and
> > > consistently...
> >
> > Automat shouldn't have been here. Practically impossible to make it
> > properly.
>
>
>No, it isn't. We should have a dictionary word-->possible-icons, and do a
>subword search in the full path for some keyword.
>
>BTW, Konqueror still doesn't show icons on tabs. Mozilla does.

Yes, it does.

> > > > > Even better, we could do like the back button in mozilla: we could
> > > > > split each taskbar button in two: one big, with the app icon, one
> > > > > small, with the arrow pointing downwards. If you click the big 
>one,
> > > > > you go to the most recent konq window. If you click the small one,
> > > > > the list of all open konq windows pops up.
> > > >
> > > > OK, but it should be something in manner of combobutton, like in 
>rest
> > > > of kapps.
> > >
> > > I'm not sure what you mean by combobutton...
> >
> > Eg. Back button in Konq.

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