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List: kde-devel
Subject: Re: Thoughts from a former KDE, currently Mozilla developer
From: Allan Sandfeld Jensen <kde () carewolf ! com>
Date: 2010-12-09 17:04:02
Message-ID: 201012091804.02894.kde () carewolf ! com
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On Tuesday 07 December 2010, George Kiagiadakis wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 11:14 PM, Thiago Macieira <thiago@kde.org> wrote:
> > On Tuesday, 7 de December de 2010 21:53:57 Benoit Jacob wrote:
> >> 2010/12/7 Thiago Macieira <thiago@kde.org>:
> >> > How are you going to properly find the stack without debug symbols?
> >> >
> >> > Imagine one frame that didn't keep the frame pointer properly?
> >>
> >> If the stack is damaged, then indeed I can't do anything; but that's
> >> not the case in a vast majority of crashes.
> >
> > Who said anything about damaged?
> >
> > The stack can be safe, but require debugging information to find where
> > the previous frame pointer was saved in the frame.
> >
> > Anyway, we need to know which version and build of each and every library
> > in each and every distribution shipping KDE.
>
> That's the real issue. The server would need to hold all the debug
> symbols from all the kde binaries of all the kde versions of all the
> possible distributions (and variants of them; for example, 2 gentoo
> users building with different USE flags may have two kde versions that
> are binary incompatible with each other). This simply doesn't scale.
>
You could however have a tool that could enable distros to do this, even if it
makes no sense from a purely KDE POV
`Allan
[Attachment #5 (text/html)]
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content="1" /><style type="text/css"> p, li { white-space: pre-wrap; }
</style></head><body style=" font-family:'Monospace'; font-size:11pt; \
font-weight:400; font-style:normal;"> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">On Tuesday 07 December 2010, George Kiagiadakis wrote:</p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at \
11:14 PM, Thiago Macieira <thiago@kde.org> wrote:</p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > On Tuesday, 7 de \
December de 2010 21:53:57 Benoit Jacob wrote:</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> >> 2010/12/7 Thiago Macieira \
<thiago@kde.org>:</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> >> > How are you going to properly find the stack \
without debug symbols?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> >> > </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> >> > Imagine one frame that didn't \
keep the frame pointer properly?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> >> </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> >> If the stack is damaged, then indeed I can't do \
anything; but that's</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> >> not the case in a vast majority of crashes.</p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > </p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > Who said anything \
about damaged?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > \
</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > The stack can be \
safe, but require debugging information to find where</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > the previous frame pointer was saved in \
the frame.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > \
</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > Anyway, we need to \
know which version and build of each and every library</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> > in each and every distribution shipping \
KDE.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> </p> \
<p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> That's the real issue. \
The server would need to hold all the debug</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> symbols from all the kde binaries of all the \
kde versions of all the</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">> possible distributions (and variants of them; for example, 2 \
gentoo</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> users \
building with different USE flags may have two kde versions that</p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> are binary incompatible \
with each other). This simply doesn't scale.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">> </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">You could however have a tool that could enable \
distros to do this, even if it makes no sense from a purely KDE POV</p> <p \
style="-qt-paragraph-type:empty; margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;"></p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">`Allan</p> <p \
style="-qt-paragraph-type:empty; margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;"></p></body></html>
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