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List:       kde-devel
Subject:    Re: Thoughts from a former KDE, currently Mozilla developer
From:       Allan Sandfeld Jensen <kde () carewolf ! com>
Date:       2010-12-09 17:04:02
Message-ID: 201012091804.02894.kde () carewolf ! com
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On Tuesday 07 December 2010, George Kiagiadakis wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 11:14 PM, Thiago Macieira <thiago@kde.org> wrote:
> > On Tuesday, 7 de December de 2010 21:53:57 Benoit Jacob wrote:
> >> 2010/12/7 Thiago Macieira <thiago@kde.org>:
> >> > How are you going to properly find the stack without debug symbols?
> >> > 
> >> > Imagine one frame that didn't keep the frame pointer properly?
> >> 
> >> If the stack is damaged, then indeed I can't do anything; but that's
> >> not the case in a vast majority of crashes.
> > 
> > Who said anything about damaged?
> > 
> > The stack can be safe, but require debugging information to find where
> > the previous frame pointer was saved in the frame.
> > 
> > Anyway, we need to know which version and build of each and every library
> > in each and every distribution shipping KDE.
> 
> That's the real issue. The server would need to hold all the debug
> symbols from all the kde binaries of all the kde versions of all the
> possible distributions (and variants of them; for example, 2 gentoo
> users building with different USE flags may have two kde versions that
> are binary incompatible with each other). This simply doesn't scale.
> 
You could however have a tool that could enable distros to do this, even if it 
makes no sense from a purely KDE POV

`Allan

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</style></head><body style=" font-family:'Monospace'; font-size:11pt; \
font-weight:400; font-style:normal;"> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">On Tuesday 07 December 2010, George Kiagiadakis wrote:</p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at \
11:14 PM, Thiago Macieira &lt;thiago@kde.org&gt; wrote:</p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; On Tuesday, 7 de \
December de 2010 21:53:57 Benoit Jacob wrote:</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; 2010/12/7 Thiago Macieira \
&lt;thiago@kde.org&gt;:</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; How are you going to properly find the stack \
without debug symbols?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Imagine one frame that didn't \
keep the frame pointer properly?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; If the stack is damaged, then indeed I can't do \
anything; but that's</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt;&gt; not the case in a vast majority of crashes.</p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; </p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; Who said anything \
about damaged?</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; \
</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; The stack can be \
safe, but require debugging information to find where</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; the previous frame pointer was saved in \
the frame.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; \
</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; Anyway, we need to \
know which version and build of each and every library</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; &gt; in each and every distribution shipping \
KDE.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; </p> \
<p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; That's the real issue. \
The server would need to hold all the debug</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; symbols from all the kde binaries of all the \
kde versions of all the</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; \
margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;">&gt; possible distributions (and variants of them; for example, 2 \
gentoo</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; users \
building with different USE flags may have two kde versions that</p> <p style=" \
margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; are binary incompatible \
with each other). This simply doesn't scale.</p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">&gt; </p> <p style=" margin-top:0px; \
margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; \
text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">You could however have a tool that could enable \
distros to do this, even if it makes no sense from a purely KDE POV</p> <p \
style="-qt-paragraph-type:empty; margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;"></p> <p \
style=" margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; margin-right:0px; \
-qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; -qt-user-state:0;">`Allan</p> <p \
style="-qt-paragraph-type:empty; margin-top:0px; margin-bottom:0px; margin-left:0px; \
margin-right:0px; -qt-block-indent:0; text-indent:0px; \
-qt-user-state:0;"></p></body></html>



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