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List:       kde-debian
Subject:    Re: kactions, toolbars and pop up menus in KCModules
From:       Frans Englich <frans.englich () telia ! com>
Date:       2004-01-26 23:49:02
Message-ID: 200401270049.02981.frans.englich () telia ! com
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On Tuesday 27 January 2004 01:45, Pupeno wrote:
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> On Monday 26 January 2004 16:48, Frans Englich wrote:
> > On Monday 26 January 2004 16:55, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
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> > > On January 25, 2004 11:42, Pupeno wrote:
> > > > Hi kde developers...
> > > > I've been reading documentation about kaction, kaction collection,
> > > > ktoolbar, qdockbar, etc, etc, and I can't find the solution to this.
> > > > I want to create some KActions in a KCModule and have them in a
> > > > toolbar and some pop up (right click on a klistview) menus.
> > >
> > > you need to manually plug() them in rather than use an XMLUI .rc file
> > > ... seeing as toolbars, etc should be the exception rather than the
> > > rule in kcms (they are dialogs, not apps!) i don't think this warrants
> > > making kcm a XMLUI-integrated class ...
> >
> > Regarding toolbars in kcms.. usability wise I personally react a little
> > awkward. Is toolbars in kcms something we think is a good idea or is it a
> > Bad Thing? (Something to put in KCM_CONVENTIONS I guess)
> >
> > I would say there's many good reasons to say it is a bad idea.
>
> I'm making a user management kcm, I want a toolbar to add users, remove

Cool :) It is definitely appreciated and needed.

> users, change passwords, comments, etc... do you think it is a bad idea ? -

I can easily imagine that interaction is helped by toolbars considering what 
functionality your kcm provides, no doubt. The problem lies not on your 
particular kcm but rather at KControl and the kcm "technology". IMHO, 
KControl is too ambitious - it covers a too wide content and is designed to 
be used in certain way(it collects and presents small amounts of settings and 
the way of interaction that means).
For example, your kcm and other "units" which provides administration 
functionality, is really not just "settings" but something the user will work 
in a whole another way with, hence the need for toolbars and xmlui. Putting 
everything in KControl hurts KControl as well as ie. your kcm could be in a 
better place(for example the space the KCM widget gets is way to small in 
order to "work" in).
As graphical server administration such as user management, mail server, 
kernel config, etc ad infinitum becomes more common in KDE this problem will 
be more and more clear. Furthermore, it is also suitable if all those 
different admin tasks were collected under one umbrella task such as 
KControl, although it perhaps needs to be more sophisticated, somewhere 
inbetween a kcm and kpart perhaps. I don't thing it is handy from a 
development nor user perspective having it as separate programs. This issue 
was highlighted a couple of weeks ago on kde-usability, the imaginative 
umbrella app was called "KAdmin". 

You definitely should get in touch with kde-debian who focus on issues like 
yours. I would bet they work on something similar already and it could be a 
good idea trying to unify work and avoid duplicate work. They also got more 
decent stuff to say in this matter, in contrast to my guessing. (CC'ing, feel 
free to cross post, IMHO).

Cheers,

			Frans

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