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List:       wikipedia-l
Subject:    Re: [Wikipedia-l] correction of errors in articles
From:       Heiko Evermann <heiko.evermann () gmx ! de>
Date:       2005-08-13 18:51:51
Message-ID: 200508132051.51467.heiko.evermann () gmx ! de
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Hi Sabine,
> What would you all say about a wikipedian or a wiktionarian that knows
> how to edit and correct an error and does not do it but tries to defame
> a person stating that there is an error and therefore a contribution is
> not valid.
>
> To my opinion this person is not a community person, but wants just to
> show how brave she/he is or cut someone out of the way - or am I wrong?
>
> Sorry, but I have a discussion here and I would like to know your
> impartial opinion on that.
Am I right to assume that you are referring to the argument that we two are 
having at the moment? My italian is not so good, but from what I understand 
in http://it.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wikizionario:Bar#Low_Saxon_import, the onw 
you say is not a community person, seems to be me.

If you want to know an impartial opinion from this list, it would be good to 
state some more of the facts. 
1) We have been having a discussion about the import of a list of approx. 2500 
entries into nds.wiktionary.org. You have started to do so and have imported 
about 50 entries.
2) Several people from nds.wikipedia.org (who also happen to work on 
nds.wiktionary.org) then asked you to stop that, because the list contains a 
huge number of problems. Including
2.1) Plain errors in capitalization
2.2) Grave errors in spelling. Now this point is important. While there are 
several spelling options in Low Saxon, this list is going its own private 
way. This can easiliy be verified by googling for these words. In a huge 
number of instances, what you get is the original list and some mirrors of 
this list. Now this should make one think, shouldn't it? These words follow 
the spelling of the author of this list, but in a huge number of cases this 
spelling is unorthodox according to *any* standard of Low Saxon. I think it 
was 4 people on nds.wiktionary.org who told you so. Nevertheless you and 
Gerard just had a different point of view. You said that there is no official 
spelling in Low Saxon and therefore every spelling that can be found is 
worthy of inclusion into nds.wiktionary.org. I (and Slomox) had then offered 
to work through the import list beforehand to correct obvious mistakes, so 
that as much as possible of this list could be imported as quickly as 
possible and to discuss the outstainding problems *before* importing them. 
There is one important reason for this: It is much much faster to edit *one* 
textfile instead of going through the browser interface of the wiktionary 
afterwards. From my understanding this was a proposal that you agreed to. 
After all the import was stopped (as requested by the majority on 
nds.wiktionary.org), wasn't it?
Yesterday I discovered that you had imported the whole uncorrected list into 
the Italian wiktionary *after* stopping the import into nds.wiktionary.org 
and *after* our discussion on nds.wiktionary.org and in private mail.  I then 
dropped a note on it.wiktionary.org that there had been a huge import of 
problematic words into it.wiktionary.org. 

Yes, I have not started correcting the entries there. I have in fact started 
correcting the entries in nds.wiktionary.org. I know that you have some kind 
of robot that can copy entries to and from wiktionaries and I still do not 
understand why you dumped the whole mess into the Italian wiktionary. What 
use are these word pairs (usually Low Saxon to German) there? Wouldn't it 
have been much simpler to work through this list in  nds.wiktionary.org and 
to copy the result of the work into it.wiktionary.org *afterwards*???

As the damage had already been done, I felt free to complain in 
it.wiktionary.org. I thought that private mail in this case was no longer 
appropriate. We had already had an exchange of private mail and my 
understanding was that you had accepted our proposal to work through the list 
before importing that to nds.wiktionary.org. This (to my understanding) also 
includes not to import this stuff into other wiktionaries.

So what does that tell us about you and community work?

Again
> What would you all say about a wikipedian or a wiktionarian that knows
> how to edit and correct an error and does not do it but tries to defame
> a person stating that there is an error and therefore a contribution is
> not valid.
The errors are being corrected in nds.wiktionary.org, which is quite a lot of 
work and I do not want to double that work by having to correct all these 
things in it.wiktionary.org too. My time is limited. I also have work to do 
and I do have a family. 

It is not my intention to defame you. I only wanted to inform the other users 
of it.wiktionary.org about the problems.

Please read my statement on 
http://it.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wikizionario:Bar#Low_Saxon_import

"I suggest to delete all these automatic imports and to wait until the list in 
nds.wiktionary.org is in a state that is ready for automatic import."

> To my opinion this person is not a community person, but wants just to
> show how brave she/he is or cut someone out of the way - or am I wrong?
You are wrong indeed. I just want to see a good quality wiktionary for Low 
Saxon. Besides that I value peaceful and friendly collaboration. Creating 
facts (as you did) is not a good way to go.

Kind regards,

Heiko Evermann
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