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List: web4lib
Subject: Re: [WEB4LIB] Data Tracker Word vs Excel
From: M Belvadi <mbelvadi () GMAIL ! COM>
Date: 2022-06-19 9:15:24
Message-ID: CANur068GBqVkCMb12o-h-BhnZEFq0d6F_utz04zrBFDdGS1bEw () mail ! gmail ! com
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A bit late to the party, but I would add not only is Excel (or Google
Sheets) far superior than a Word table for this, but you should seriously
consider whether you can use tab-delimited (tsv) instead of comma-delimited
(csv) for your purposes later. In theory, csv should "protect" commas
within your data via the use of quote marks around each "column", but I
find so many problems with this so often that I now try to use tsv
exclusively for this kind of data. I've never heard of any case of having a
tab character in this kind of data.
As someone else mentioned, you should think about your use cases. You may
want to not only sort but perhaps also filter on your data, especially that
last column which appears to be a boolean y/n.
I'm working with our faculty union's membership list right now, and we have
lots of cases of values like that, that we then want to generate an email
"merge" for only a subset of the data, eg. only people who have a "no" in
particular columns, etc.
By the way, people's names are more than last name, first name. Most people
have a middle name or at least initial. You need to think about where you
want to put that, and again it depends on what you plan to do with the
data. For instance, if you plan to generate an email using a "merge"
script, and your template will start with: Dear {{first name}}, it might
look weird if it comes out as "Dear Susan B." if you put the middle initial
in the first name column.
Also consider if you have international students who come from cultures
where last name and first name are by American standards "backwards"
(India, a lot of east Asian countries). That's why a lot of programs call
these "Family name" and "Given name" instead of first and last.
I'm doing ours in Google Sheets for many reasons including a much easier to
use scripting language for doing things like the mail merge - I found a
great free script someone else had already written - as well as a much
better "forms" (better data validation) that feeds responses into the
spreadsheet in its own tab, and then from there you can easily set up
formulas in other tabs (worksheets) to do things with that data using QUERY
and VLOOKUP. It depends on your use cases, but there's just so much more
power in spreadsheets than a Word doc for future use cases that you haven't
imagined yet.
I once heard someone explain that most people misunderstand
Excel/spreadsheets as being just a different kind of word processor,
whereas in fact it's more useful to think of spreadsheets as a programming
environment whose language syntax is based on a particular kind of data
structure (tables). This conceptual model illuminates the significantly
greater power over your data that you'll have.
Melissa Belvadi
mbelvadi@gmail.com
On Tue, Jun 14, 2022 at 6:37 AM Patrice Chalon <patrice.chalon.kce@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Hello,
> If you already own an O365 license (and are familiar with Office suite),
> - Excel is a good choice to manage such data (you should only care of long
> text fields if importing a csv file)
> - Forms from Office365 (online) is a good option to collect such data, :
> you can easily export the data to an Excel file (there should be no problem
> with long text fields)
> Hope it helps
> Patrice
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 10:30 PM charles meyer <reachmeplace@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi my esteemed listmates,
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm launching a new library contest.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'd like to be able to sort participants by their given and surnames and
>> the names of their submitted project names alphabetically and for all the
>> data included in the respective columns.
>>
>>
>>
>> I was contemplating this…
>>
>>
>>
>> Column A = Last name
>>
>> Column B = First name
>>
>> Column C = their email address
>>
>> Column D = their phone number
>>
>> Column E = their project name
>>
>> Column F = if they participated before (or first time) in any library
>> program
>>
>>
>>
>> Say I wish to sort alphabetically by last or first name or by project
>> name or by if they're a 1st time participant, etc.
>>
>>
>>
>> I've learned with Excel it's best to plan your columns for data before
>> you start inputting their data.
>>
>>
>>
>> Would creating a Word Table in 365 be a better tool than Excel for this?
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm also trying to ensure that if I have the benefit of an online program
>> (participants register on) I can export that data as a .csv file and that
>> it will import all these fields into the correct respect columns?
>>
>>
>>
>> Ex. How do I ensure when I export the online file as a .csv that when it
>> imports it doesn't dump all the data into Column A but rather imports the
>> last name into Column A, first name into Column B, etc.?
>>
>>
>>
>> Have you had to take extra measures to ensure all the data from an online
>> program exports correctly into the Columns you' set up in Excel or tables
>> in Word?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>>
>> Charles.
>>
>>
>>
>>
[Attachment #3 (text/html)]
<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">A bit late to the \
party, but I would add not only is Excel (or Google Sheets) far superior than a Word \
table for this, but you should seriously consider whether you can use tab-delimited \
(tsv) instead of comma-delimited (csv) for your purposes later. In theory, csv should \
"protect" commas within your data via the use of quote marks around each \
"column", but I find so many problems with this so often that I now try to \
use tsv exclusively for this kind of data. I've never heard of any case of having \
a tab character in this kind of data.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">As someone else mentioned, you should think about your use \
cases. You may want to not only sort but perhaps also filter on your data, especially \
that last column which appears to be a boolean y/n.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">I'm working with our faculty union's membership list \
right now, and we have lots of cases of values like that, that we then want to \
generate an email "merge" for only a subset of the data, eg. only people \
who have a "no" in particular columns, etc.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">By the way, people's names are more than last name, first \
name. Most people have a middle name or at least initial. You need to think about \
where you want to put that, and again it depends on what you plan to do with the \
data. For instance, if you plan to generate an email using a "merge" \
script, and your template will start with: Dear {{first name}}, it might look weird \
if it comes out as "Dear Susan B." if you put the middle initial in the \
first name column.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">Also consider if you have international students who come \
from cultures where last name and first name are by American standards \
"backwards" (India, a lot of east Asian countries). That's why a lot \
of programs call these "Family name" and "Given name" instead of \
first and last.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">I'm doing ours in Google Sheets for many reasons \
including a much easier to use scripting language for doing things like the mail \
merge - I found a great free script someone else had already written - as well as a \
much better "forms" (better data validation) that feeds responses into the \
spreadsheet in its own tab, and then from there you can easily set up formulas in \
other tabs (worksheets) to do things with that data using QUERY and VLOOKUP. It \
depends on your use cases, but there's just so much more power in spreadsheets \
than a Word doc for future use cases that you haven't imagined yet.</div><div \
class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small">I once heard someone explain that most people misunderstand \
Excel/spreadsheets as being just a different kind of word processor, whereas in fact \
it's more useful to think of spreadsheets as a programming environment whose \
language syntax is based on a particular kind of data structure (tables). This \
conceptual model illuminates the significantly greater power over your data that \
you'll have.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-size:small"><br></div><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" \
data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div>Melissa Belvadi</div><div><a \
href="mailto:mbelvadi@gmail.com" \
target="_blank">mbelvadi@gmail.com</a></div></div></div></div><br></div><br><div \
class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 14, 2022 at 6:37 AM \
Patrice Chalon <<a \
href="mailto:patrice.chalon.kce@gmail.com">patrice.chalon.kce@gmail.com</a>> \
wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px \
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div \
dir="ltr">Hello,<div>If you already own an O365 license (and are familiar with Office \
suite), <br><div>- Excel is a good choice to manage such data (you should only care \
of long text fields if importing a csv file)</div><div>- Forms from Office365 \
(online) is a good option to collect such data, : you can easily export the data to \
an Excel file (there should be no problem with long text fields)</div></div><div>Hope \
it helps</div><div>Patrice</div><div><br></div></div><br><div \
class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 10:30 \
PM charles meyer <<a href="mailto:reachmeplace@gmail.com" \
target="_blank">reachmeplace@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div \
dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:small">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Hi my esteemed listmates,<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">I'm launching a new library contest.<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">I'd like to be able to sort participants by their given and \
surnames and the names of their submitted project names alphabetically and for all \
the data included in the respective columns.<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">I was contemplating this…<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column A = Last name<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column B = First name<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column C = their email address<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column D = their phone number<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column E = their project name<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Column F = if they participated before (or first time) in any \
library program<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Say I wish to sort alphabetically by last or first name or by \
project name or by if they're a 1<sup>st</sup> time participant, \
etc.<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">I've learned with Excel it's best to plan your columns for data \
before you start inputting their data.<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Would creating a Word Table in 365 be a better tool than Excel for \
this?<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">I'm also trying to ensure that if I have the benefit of an online \
program (participants register on) I can export that data as a .csv file and that it \
will import all these fields into the correct respect columns?<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Ex. How do I ensure when I export the online file as a .csv that \
when it imports it doesn't dump all the data into Column A but rather imports the \
last name into Column A, first name into Column B, etc.?<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Have you had to take extra measures to ensure all the data from an \
online program exports correctly into the Columns you' set up in Excel or tables in \
Word?<span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Thank you!</p><p class="MsoNormal" \
style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal" \
style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif">Charles.</p><p class="MsoNormal" \
style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><br></p><br><p class="MsoNormal" \
style="margin:0in;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Bookman Old \
Style",serif"><span></span></p>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div>
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