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List: squeak-dev
Subject: [squeak-dev] Re: Let's discuss the future of Etoys in Squeak 6.1 (and beyond)
From: Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda () gmail ! com>
Date: 2023-08-31 19:43:22
Message-ID: BCBC4516-B9CB-44F5-B59A-3E115C5B5D9E () gmail ! com
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> On Aug 29, 2023, at 6:48 AM, Marcel Taeumel via Squeak-dev \
> <squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> Hi all --
>
> Please find attached a change-set that unloads Etoys from Squeak 6.1alpha #22748 \
> (and later).
> Let us use this artifact to discuss the future of Etoys in Squeak 6.1 and beyond. \
> You can use Monticello or the ChangeSorter to take a look at what's needed besides \
> unloading the Etoys package itself. Also check preamble and postscript of the \
> attached change-set.
> !!! Yes, simply re-loading the Etoys package is not enough to restore basic Etoys \
> functionality. There are several sub-method changes needed for the Etoys \
> integration into the base system.
> Here is what would still work through the package MorphicExtras:
> - Games
> - Sketches and PaintBox
> - Flaps
> - CalendarMorph
> - SpectrumAnalyzerMorph
>
> Here is what would still "work" through the package System:
> - Object storage (ImageSegment etc.)
> - ProjectLoading
>
> Here is what would still work through the package Protocols:
> - Lexicon tool
> - Vocabulary framework
>
> Here is what would be gone:
> - Tiles, viewers, and scripts
> - Players and costumes
> - Pen trails, Turtles, ...
> - References, CustomEventsRegistry, ScriptingSystem
> - Siblings for (Player-only) uni-classes
> - DeepCopier support for (Player-only) uni-classes
> - Preferences #noviceMode, #eToyFriendly, and more
>
> Note that we still have several Etoys-compatible releases such as Etoys 4/5/6 and \
> Squeak 5.1/5.2/5.3/6.0. Best compatibility is probably with Etoys 5. Most updated \
> base system is probably Squeak 6.0. :-)
> So...should we remove Etoys from Trunk at this point?
I would like to see EToys cleanly unloadable, but I would like it to remain in the \
standard distribution. Certain EToys functionality, such as the webcam support, \
should be separated from the core EToys package. A proper list of these elements \
that have broader use should be made.
>
> Please share your thoughts. And feel free to also report issues with loading/using \
> the attached change-set itself.
> Best,
> Marcel
> <unload-etoys.33.cs>
>
[Attachment #5 (text/html)]
<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; \
charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div \
dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Aug 29, 2023, at 6:48 AM, Marcel Taeumel via \
Squeak-dev <squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org> \
wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div \
id="__MailbirdStyleContent" style="font-size: 10pt;font-family: Arial;color: \
#000000;text-align: left" dir="ltr"><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Hi all \
--</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px">Please find attached a change-set that unloads Etoys \
from Squeak 6.1alpha #22748 (and later).</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Let us use this \
artifact to discuss the future of Etoys in Squeak 6.1 and beyond. You can use \
Monticello or the ChangeSorter to take a look at what's needed besides unloading the \
Etoys package itself. Also check preamble and postscript of the attached \
change-set.</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div>!!! Yes, simply re-loading the Etoys package is not \
enough to restore basic Etoys functionality. There are several sub-method changes \
needed for the Etoys integration into the base system.<span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Here is what \
would still work through the package MorphicExtras:</span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Games</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">- Sketches and PaintBox</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">- Flaps</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- \
CalendarMorph</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- \
SpectrumAnalyzerMorph</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Here is what \
would still "work" through the package System:</span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Object storage (ImageSegment \
etc.)</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- \
ProjectLoading</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Here is what \
would still work through the package Protocols:</span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Lexicon tool</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">- Vocabulary framework</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Here is what \
would be gone:</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Tiles, viewers, \
and scripts</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Players and \
costumes</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Pen trails, Turtles, \
...</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- References, \
CustomEventsRegistry, ScriptingSystem</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">- Siblings for (Player-only) uni-classes</span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px">- DeepCopier support for (Player-only) \
uni-classes</span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">- Preferences \
#noviceMode, #eToyFriendly, and more</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 13.3333px">Note that we \
still have several Etoys-compatible releases such as Etoys 4/5/6 and Squeak \
5.1/5.2/5.3/6.0. Best compatibility is probably with Etoys 5. Most updated base \
system is probably Squeak 6.0. :-)</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><b>So...should we remove Etoys from Trunk at this \
point?</b><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px"><br></span></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I would like to \
see EToys cleanly unloadable, but I would like it to remain in the standard \
distribution. Certain EToys functionality, such as the webcam support, should \
be separated from the core EToys package. A proper list of these elements that \
have broader use should be made.<div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div \
id="__MailbirdStyleContent" style="font-size: 10pt;font-family: Arial;color: \
#000000;text-align: left" dir="ltr"><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">Please share your thoughts. And feel free to also report issues with \
loading/using the attached change-set itself.</span></div><div><span \
style="font-size: 13.3333px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">Best,</span></div><div><span style="font-size: \
13.3333px">Marcel</span></div><div class="mb_sig"></div><div \
class="mb_sig"></div></div><div><unload-etoys.33.cs></div><span></span><br></div></blockquote></div></body></html>
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