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List: qubes-devel
Subject: Re: [qubes-devel] GSOC Introduction
From: John Casey <john.casey.1 () ucdconnect ! ie>
Date: 2017-04-02 19:25:30
Message-ID: 09dcd07b-2735-4498-92ce-a26302717496 () googlegroups ! com
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On Sunday, 2 April 2017 19:43:34 UTC+1, Jean-Philippe Ouellet wrote:
>
> On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 1:50 PM, John Casey <john.c...@ucdconnect.ie
> <javascript:>> wrote:
> > On Saturday, 1 April 2017 22:33:10 UTC+1, Marek Marczykowski-Górecki
> wrote:
> > > On Sat, Apr 01, 2017 at 01:52:27PM -0700, John Casey wrote:
> > > > I like the idea of improving the usability of the project because a
> > > > scary
> > > > or non existence interface can often cause users move away.
> > > >
> > > > Playing with GTK, I think many of these issues should be suitable for
> > > > GSOC.
> > >
> > > Oh, and there is one more thing - VM settings window. In Qubes 4.0
> we're
> > > going to decompose Qubes VM Manager into separate applications[2]. VM
> > > status monitoring (moved to Xfce4 panel applet) is already handled by
> > > Kalkin-, but it isn't all. Initially we've planned to reuse old
> Qt-based
> > > VM settings window as standalone application and simply call it from
> the
> > > menu and/or that applet. But if you'd like to rewrite it in GTK as GSoC
> > > project, that would be great! That old Qt-based code isn't perfect
> piece
> > > of software... There was an attempt to do that already and also some
> > > code is available[3], but it's far from complete and finishing that
> work
> > > (if any of that would be good enough to use...) would still be a
> perfect
> > > 3-month task.
> >
> > That sounds fantastic, as it would definitely improve my GTK knowledge.
> I
> > see that there hasn't been a commit to in almost a year. Has bnvk
> > changed direction, or is it just waiting for someone to pick up the code
> and
> > work on it?
>
> See [0], especially bnvk's note at the bottom.
>
> [0]:
> https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/1870#issuecomment-223055937
>
Thanks, that explains rather bare-bones nature of the above repo. That
comment also serves as good introduction to the requirements for any
implementation independent of the GTK vs Qt discussion.
>
> > Would rewriting it in GTK be busywork, or would it be more effective to
> > learn and build it in Qt. Does Qubes plan to change to GTK entirely?
>
> See discussion in
> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/qubes-devel/2pWolRF3otY/discussion
>
> AFAIK the current answer is "Yes, the plan is to change to GTK
> entirely", but it's not clear to me whether or not this is the best
> plan.
>
I find it very interesting the process for choosing a technology in open
source projects. In addition, it seems that no matter which is chosen,
there will always be those who would have preferred the other. An example
being the XFCE vs KDE argument I've seen elsewhere in the Qubes community.
So the Gnome change has been pushed into the future, and as a result, a lot
of the benefit of GTK as also been pushed to the future. Is that
approximately correct?
Additionally, I haven't been able to find any current sources for a Gnome
transition to Qt, and that discussion is from 2013.
Finally, I feel the need to underline by inexperience in these matters as
until the last month my knowledge of OSS has been limited to download,
build and run. So take my input with a pinch of salt.
Regards,
John.
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<div dir="ltr">On Sunday, 2 April 2017 19:43:34 UTC+1, Jean-Philippe Ouellet \
wrote:<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0;margin-left: \
0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;">On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 1:50 PM, \
John Casey <<a href="javascript:" target="_blank" \
gdf-obfuscated-mailto="yRSNjqmXCwAJ" rel="nofollow" \
onmousedown="this.href='javascript:';return true;" \
onclick="this.href='javascript:';return \
true;">john.c...@ucdconnect.ie</a>> wrote: <br>> On Saturday, 1 April 2017 \
22:33:10 UTC+1, Marek Marczykowski-Górecki wrote: <br>>> On Sat, Apr 01, 2017 \
at 01:52:27PM -0700, John Casey wrote: <br>>> > I like the idea of improving \
the usability of the project because a <br>>> > scary
<br>>> > or non existence interface can often cause users move away.
<br>>> >
<br>>> > Playing with GTK, I think many of these issues should be suitable \
for <br>>> > GSOC.
<br>>>
<br>>> Oh, and there is one more thing - VM settings window. In Qubes 4.0 \
we're <br>>> going to decompose Qubes VM Manager into separate \
applications[2]. VM <br>>> status monitoring (moved to Xfce4 panel applet) is \
already handled by <br>>> Kalkin-, but it isn't all. Initially we've \
planned to reuse old Qt-based <br>>> VM settings window as standalone \
application and simply call it from the <br>>> menu and/or that applet. But if \
you'd like to rewrite it in GTK as GSoC <br>>> project, that would be \
great! That old Qt-based code isn't perfect piece <br>>> of software... \
There was an attempt to do that already and also some <br>>> code is \
available[3], but it's far from complete and finishing that work <br>>> (if \
any of that would be good enough to use...) would still be a perfect <br>>> \
3-month task. <br>>
<br>> That sounds fantastic, as it would definitely improve my GTK knowledge. I
<br>> see that there hasn't been a commit to in almost a year. Has bnvk
<br>> changed direction, or is it just waiting for someone to pick up the code and
<br>> work on it?
<br>
<br>See [0], especially bnvk's note at the bottom.
<br>
<br>[0]: <a href="https://github.com/QubesOS/qubes-issues/issues/1870#issuecomment-223055937" \
target="_blank" rel="nofollow" \
onmousedown="this.href='https://www.google.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2 \
FQubesOS%2Fqubes-issues%2Fissues%2F1870%23issuecomment-223055937\x26sa\x3dD\x26sntz\x3d1\x26usg\x3dAFQjCNGUhPRoLOxDA9l67ekbb_pQw4QUUw';return \
true;" onclick="this.href='https://www.google.com/url?q\x3dhttps%3A%2F%2Fgithub.co \
m%2FQubesOS%2Fqubes-issues%2Fissues%2F1870%23issuecomment-223055937\x26sa\x3dD\x26sntz\x3d1\x26usg\x3dAFQjCNGUhPRoLOxDA9l67ekbb_pQw4QUUw';return \
true;">https://github.com/QubesOS/<wbr>qubes-issues/issues/1870#<wbr>issuecomment-223055937</a>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Thanks, that explains rather bare-bones nature \
of the above repo. That comment also serves as good introduction to the requirements \
for any implementation independent of the GTK vs Qt discussion.</div><div> \
<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0;margin-left: \
0.8ex;border-left: 1px #ccc solid;padding-left: 1ex;"> <br>> Would rewriting it in \
GTK be busywork, or would it be more effective to <br>> learn and build it in Qt. \
Does Qubes plan to change to GTK entirely? <br>
<br>See discussion in
<br><a href="https://groups.google.com/d/topic/qubes-devel/2pWolRF3otY/discussion" \
target="_blank" rel="nofollow" \
onmousedown="this.href='https://groups.google.com/d/topic/qubes-devel/2pWolRF3otY/discussion';return \
true;" onclick="this.href='https://groups.google.com/d/topic/qubes-devel/2pWolRF3otY/discussion';return \
true;">https://groups.google.com/d/<wbr>topic/qubes-devel/2pWolRF3otY/<wbr>discussion</a>
<br>
<br>AFAIK the current answer is "Yes, the plan is to change to GTK
<br>entirely", but it's not clear to me whether or not this is the best
<br>plan.
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I find it very interesting the process for \
choosing a technology in open source projects. In addition, it seems that no matter \
which is chosen, there will always be those who would have preferred the other. An \
example being the XFCE vs KDE argument I've seen elsewhere in the Qubes \
community.</div><div><br></div><div>So the Gnome change has been pushed into the \
future, and as a result, a lot of the benefit of GTK as also been pushed to the \
future. Is that approximately correct?</div><div><br></div><div>Additionally, I \
haven't been able to find any current sources for a Gnome transition to Qt, and \
that discussion is from 2013.</div><div><br></div><div>Finally, I feel the need to \
underline by inexperience in these matters as until the last month my knowledge of \
OSS has been limited to download, build and run. So take my input with a pinch of \
salt.</div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>John.</div></div>
<p></p>
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