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List:       openbsd-misc
Subject:    Re: guide newcomers better
From:       <trader () lotr ! nu>
Date:       2002-01-03 20:48:01
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Hello,
            There are always going to be people who answer you in "rude"
manner, however there is a simple answer... just ignore them. Most of the
times if the question you asked is valid (and posted in the right place ;) )
someone will try to help you. OpenBSD (Unix in general) can have a steep
learning curve if you started out on say Windows or DOS, however this is for
a reason, Unix is simply so much more powerful / versitile and once you get
a hang of it it will save you lots of time. The main point is that you have
to be prepared to read alot, and ask alot.

I think that OpenBSD has certain issues with documentation compared to other
unix flavours, that's why I have decided to contribute and write some tutes
that deal with fairly advanced stuff (well for beginenrs anyhow) but are
written so that newbies can follow them. Writing tutes is btw a great way to
learn! A good source for help except these mailing lists is IRC, and sites
for other unix flavours (the freebsd site has good documentation of which
most can be applied to OpenBSD). FreeBSD also has a larger user community
that produce alot of tutes that almost all can be used when your stuck in
OpenBSD. Then there are the daemonnews.org like sites that tend to have good
tutorials and articals. Also when searching for information on sya google
always look a bit wider, instead of searching for just "my problem" AND
"OpenBSD" search for "my problem" AND "BSD" which will more likely get you
what you want. Most information is out there the problem is finding it! If
your into the reverse engineering scene there is a site called Fravias
fortress which has excellent articals on searching procedures, can't
rememeber the URL though... just search for "Fravia" AND "fortress" AND
"reverse enginnering" or the like.

Well enough of my ramblings. Hope some of this may be of help to you.
Greets.

cHeCksUm



----- Original Message -----
From: "Neels Janosch Hofmeyr" <neels@gmx.net>
To: <misc@openbsd.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2002 11:36 PM
Subject: guide newcomers better
> hi folks,
>
> i have bought OpenBSD 3.0 and am having a strange install issue, which is
the
> subject of another mail.
>
> this mail's subject however is about my being a misguided newcomer:
>
> don't take this as a whining protest please, i just feel i ought to tell
you
> what happened to a, whatchacallit, to a potential contributor to your
> community.
> i don't expect replies upon this, i just want this to be noted by someone
> whom it concerns.
>
> upon my installation difficulties, i tried to find people having the same
> problem, starting on http://www.openbsd.org/errata.html and carrying on
from
> there via the openbsd.org home.
>
> however, after having clicked around for probably an hour i decided that i
> will not find my specific error described anywhere.
>
> now the reason why i am writing this:
>
> i had no idea where to direct my questions and still am not sure. wim from
> kd85.org never replied until today, thanks for that :(
>
> on openbsd.org, i was informed about the existence of the mail address
> bugs@openbsd.org, and that was about it.
> it did not say that bugs@ was a mailing list (which i assume since i got
> replies from different places and people)
> and IT DID NOT SAY that there is another address, namely misc@openbsd.org.
> ...well, at least i was dumb enough not to identify it as compatible with
my
> objectives.
> if we assume that i am one of the less uncapable people out there, this
sure
> means something.
>
> i got some not-so-100%-nice replies which told me to post my no-bug-report
> elsewhere (which is how i got hold of this address)
> [btw thanks for those replies that were friendly]
>
> please note:
> still i don't really know whether this is the appropriate place to post
this.
> try not to be mad at me if it's not.
>
> please, if someone is out there who is connected to how openbsd.org looks
and
> is structured, do your homework like i am told to do and include some
newbie
> information (where it will be looked for, that is).
>
> right now i feel pretty alone with my problem and also a little hated by
you
> "real OpenBSD people".
> for sure i am not happy about having BOUGHT the operating system OpenBSD,
> since i expected at least some basic, reasonable service and
functionality.
>
> it is now weeks ago and this, sorry for that but i can't help it:
> and this damn operating system still hates me.
>
> i started with very high spirits and have been very, very disappointed.
> i haven't even got the installation to START in the first place, for a
long
> time now, and i'm really really sure it's not my fault.
>
> if friends asked me about it now, i would definitely have to tell them
that
> OpenBSD is not a good operating system (with political issues off the
table
> of course), which is the reason why i avoid talking to friends about it.
>
> okay, that's all of my feedback on that topic. i hate giving good people
bad
> news, but there's improvement needed.
>
> oh, and remember:
> don't take this as a whining protest please, i just feel i ought to tell
you
> what happened to a, whatchacallit, to a potential contributor to your
> community.
> i don't expect replies upon this, i just want this to be noted by someone
> whom it concerns.
>
> best wishes,
> neels

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