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List: nanog
Subject: Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)
From: Mike Hammett <nanog () ics-il ! net>
Date: 2018-12-27 19:34:04
Message-ID: 1070675904.7469.1545939242369.JavaMail.mhammett () ThunderFuck
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I guess today shows how important vendor diversity can be. :-)
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mehmet Akcin" <mehmet@akcin.net>
To: "Mike Hammett" <nanog@ics-il.net>
Cc: "Ben Cannon" <ben@6by7.net>, "nanog" <nanog@nanog.org>
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2018 2:51:38 PM
Subject: Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)
Back to main discussion....
How do we choose the best transport?
One question, how much people care about vendor diversity? I do and did care. I don't \
want to put all my eggs in one basket. Do you care? Thank you
Mehmet
On Sat, Dec 15, 2018 at 11:30 Mike Hammett < nanog@ics-il.net > wrote:
I haven't.
Sure, but the equipment still does smaller channels. Going to 100G or 400G for just \
over 10G seems silly.
If Equinix had reasonable cross connects, I'd just LAG 10Gs. The cost of a pair of \
Equinix cross connects isn't much less than the 10G wave. Thankfully I'm only in one \
datacenter with such a ridiculous model.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
From: "Ben Cannon" < ben@6by7.net >
To: "Mike Hammett" < nanog@ics-il.net >
Cc: "Luke Guillory" < lguillory@reservetele.com >, "nanog" < nanog@nanog.org >
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 1:27:21 PM
Subject: Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)
Mike have you looked at Packetlight? Long-haul is mostly jumping to 100 or even 400g \
coherent.
-Ben
On Dec 15, 2018, at 8:53 AM, Mike Hammett < nanog@ics-il.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
FS had one, but it's not on their site anymore.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
From: "Luke Guillory" < lguillory@reservetele.com >
To: "Mike Hammett" < nanog@ics-il.net >
Cc: "Eric Dugas" < edugas@unknowndevice.ca >, "nanog" < nanog@nanog.org >
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 10:52:19 AM
Subject: Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)
No cost affective 10x10G to 100G muxponder?
Sent from my iPad
On Dec 15, 2018, at 4:46 AM, Mike Hammett < nanog@ics-il.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
heh, cross connects are indeed a major issue. I have a need for > 10G transport. My \
equipment supports 40G. The carriers aren't terribly interested in doing 40G \
transport (at least not at a reasonable price, one quote was over 4x a 10G). \
100G-capable switches cost too much. Equinix charges as much for a pair of cross \
connects as a 10G wave. Carriers aren't likely to be interested in using bidi optics \
or passive WDM to overcome the ridiculous cross connect charges.
This all complicates how one chooses transport. There's no easy path forward.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
From: "Eric Dugas" < edugas@unknowndevice.ca >
To: "Mehmet Akcin" < mehmet@akcin.net >
Cc: "nanog" < nanog@nanog.org >
Sent: Friday, December 14, 2018 11:42:53 AM
Subject: Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)
I also look at hand-off locations (as long as it doesn't compromise the overall \
robustness of the design).
Most providers will be able to hand-off in the BMMR of a carrier hotel and some will \
have the flexibility to hand-off in particular suites within the same building or \
other locations near where the cross-connects fees are lower. I've seen cross-connect \
fees between $50 up to $750 MRC so if you need multiple wavelengths (for capacity), \
the cross-connect fees are going to make a huge difference on the total MRC.
Eric
Luke Guillory
Vice President – Technology and Innovation
Tel: 985.536.1212
Fax: 985.536.0300
Email: lguillory@reservetele.com
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<blockquote>
On Dec 14 2018, at 12:17 pm, Mehmet Akcin < mehmet@akcin.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
Thank you everyone incredible amounts of responses for my how to choose a transit \
provider smail earlier.
How do you choose transport & backbone?
Looking at key aspects like route information, diversity, aerial vs under ground \
fiber, age of fiber, outage history, length, but what else?
I will get both transport and transit as two seperate blogs.
I will also submit as a nanog paper for the meeting after next, or maybe next? I am \
probably too late by now.
Thank you for all your help. I will add your names to the thank you line ;-)
--
Mehmet
+1-424-298-1903
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
--
Mehmet
+1-424-298-1903
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style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"><b>From: \
</b>"Mehmet Akcin" <mehmet@akcin.net><br><b>To: </b>"Mike Hammett" \
<nanog@ics-il.net><br><b>Cc: </b>"Ben Cannon" <ben@6by7.net>, "nanog" \
<nanog@nanog.org><br><b>Sent: </b>Monday, December 17, 2018 2:51:38 \
PM<br><b>Subject: </b>Re: How to choose a \
transport(terrestrial/subsea)<br><br><div><div dir="auto">Back to main \
discussion....</div></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">How do we choose \
the best transport?</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">One question, how \
much people care about vendor diversity? I do and did care. I don't want to put all \
my eggs in one basket. Do you care? Thank you</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div \
dir="auto">Mehmet</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Sat, Dec \
15, 2018 at 11:30 Mike Hammett <<a href="mailto:nanog@ics-il.net" \
target="_blank">nanog@ics-il.net</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc \
solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div \
style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">I \
haven't.<br><br>Sure, but the equipment still does smaller channels. Going to 100G or \
400G for just over 10G seems silly.<br><br>If Equinix had reasonable cross connects, \
I'd just LAG 10Gs. The cost of a pair of Equinix cross connects isn't much less than \
the 10G wave. Thankfully I'm only in one datacenter with such a ridiculous \
model.<br><br><div><span></span><br style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'Times New \
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<p class="m_-3511104015400960605ImprintUniqueID">No cost affective 10x10G to 100G \
muxponder?</p> <div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<br>
<div id="m_-3511104015400960605AppleMailSignature" dir="ltr">Sent from my iPad</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
On Dec 15, 2018, at 4:46 AM, Mike Hammett <<a href="mailto:nanog@ics-il.net" \
target="_blank">nanog@ics-il.net</a>> wrote:<br> <br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">
heh, cross connects are indeed a major issue. I have a need for > 10G transport. \
My equipment supports 40G. The carriers aren't terribly interested in doing 40G \
transport (at least not at a reasonable price, one quote was over 4x a 10G). \
100G-capable switches cost too much. Equinix charges as much for a pair of cross \
connects as a 10G wave. Carriers aren't likely to be interested in using bidi optics \
or passive WDM to overcome the ridiculous cross connect charges.<br> <br>
This all complicates how one chooses transport. There's no easy path forward.<br>
<br>
<div><span></span><br style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'Times New \
Roman';font-size:medium;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;lette \
r-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px">
<br style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'Times New \
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<hr id="m_-3511104015400960605zwchr">
<div style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt">
<b>From: </b>"Eric Dugas" <<a href="mailto:edugas@unknowndevice.ca" \
target="_blank">edugas@unknowndevice.ca</a>><br> <b>To: </b>"Mehmet Akcin" <<a \
href="mailto:mehmet@akcin.net" target="_blank">mehmet@akcin.net</a>><br> <b>Cc: \
</b>"nanog" <<a href="mailto:nanog@nanog.org" \
target="_blank">nanog@nanog.org</a>><br> <b>Sent: </b>Friday, December 14, 2018 \
11:42:53 AM<br> <b>Subject: </b>Re: How to choose a transport(terrestrial/subsea)<br>
<br>
<div>I also look at hand-off locations (as long as it doesn't compromise the overall \
robustness of the design).</div> <br>
<div>Most providers will be able to hand-off in the BMMR of a carrier hotel and some \
will have the flexibility to hand-off in particular suites within the same building \
or other locations near where the cross-connects fees are lower. I've seen \
cross-connect fees between $50 up to $750 MRC so if you need multiple wavelengths \
(for capacity), the cross-connect fees are going to make a huge difference on the \
total MRC.</div> <br>
<div>Eric</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
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<blockquote>
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;color:#000000">
<div style="color:#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt">
<div class="m_-3511104015400960605gmail_quote_attribution">On Dec 14 2018, at 12:17 \
pm, Mehmet Akcin <<a href="mailto:mehmet@akcin.net" \
target="_blank">mehmet@akcin.net</a>> wrote:</div> <blockquote>
<div>
<div>Thank you everyone incredible amounts of responses for my how to choose a \
transit provider smail earlier.</div> <div><br>
</div>
<div>How do you choose transport & backbone?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Looking at key aspects like route information, diversity, aerial vs under ground \
fiber, age of fiber, outage history, length, but what else?</div> <div><br>
</div>
<div>I will get both transport and transit as two seperate blogs.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I will also submit as a nanog paper for the meeting after next, or maybe next? I \
am probably too late by now.</div> <div><br>
</div>
<div>Thank you for all your help. I will add your names to the thank you line \
;-)</div> <div>--</div>
<div>
<div>Mehmet</div>
<div>+1-424-298-1903</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
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</blockquote>
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<p class="m_-3511104015400960605ImprintUniqueID"></p>
<p></p>
<p></p>
</div><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div>-- \
<br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature">Mehmet<br>+1-424-298-1903</div> \
</div><br></div></body></html>
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