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List:       mozilla-java
Subject:    Re: Anyone try the exe?
From:       Stuart Ballard <sballard () netreach ! net>
Date:       1999-05-04 13:07:39
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Andy Tripp wrote:
> 
> Haviv,
> 
> haviv wrote:
> [snip]
> > But
> > I'm not sure why this is related to mozilla in any way. It doesn't
> > have XUL or nglayout which means that it won't render websites that
> > gecko can nor will it use mozilla themes.

I agree with this sentiment. I've expressed the same thing before, but I
couldn't really put my finger on why... but recently I've figured out at
least some of the reasons that I think this is so important.

> Well, both nglayout and JEditorPane and ICE render valid HTML4.0.
> Netscape (I'm assuming) has large amounts of code to also handle
> various non-valid HTML.

Sounds like an excellent reason to use (port?) nglayout rather than
using one of the less competent renderers.

> I don't think not using XUL has anything to do with what pages
> are rendered properly.  XUL is just a developers tool to help
> develop the Mozilla GUI.

This, coincidentally, is the crux of the most important reason that I
see why Jazilla should go the XUL route. I said in a previous message
that the benefits of a cross-platform UI-development tool become obvious
when you start thinking of Java as "a platform", and the response was
basically "well, why would you do that, when Java is cross-platform?".

The reason, as I see it, is this: development effort. Like it or not,
there is going to be a LOT of development effort going into the C++
version of mozilla (currently much more than into Jazilla - but even if
Jazilla had an equal amount, my point would still stand up). It seems to
me that the more of that effort that can be shared between the two
projects, the better. If Jazilla could use all the xul, css, and js
files straight out of the mozilla source, and just replace the actual
code objects running behind the scenes, then the Jazilla coders could
concentrate on the parts that *can't* be taken straight from Mozilla -
like netlib, nglayout, javascript... all the infrastructure that is
required to get the thing running. Then enhancements to the Mozilla UI
would immediately appear in Jazilla, and vice-versa.

At the beginning of this project there was a big debate about whether it
was worth porting mozilla to java, and whether it wouldn't really turn
out to be just writing a browser in java that looks something like
mozilla. At the time, I didn't think that a "port" could be done, but
people went ahead and did it anyway. Now, just when Mozilla has gotten
to the point that a *real* port is feasible, with actual sharing of code
between the projects, Jazilla is going the route of being "just a java
browser". It just seems like a shame to me.

My 0.4 nickels,
Stuart.

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