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List:       mifos-developer
Subject:    Re: [Mifos-developer] Mobile computing and java on a cell phone
From:       "Youssef M. Assad" <youssef.assad () gmail ! com>
Date:       2006-06-21 19:00:05
Message-ID: 20060621190005.GA4787 () localhost ! localdomain
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Hi.

Just thinking out loud here...

Caveat, James certainly knows heaps more about this kind of thing than I
do!

There's also the option of employing SMS in some sense. I'd worked
previously on a project where one of the technology choices was to set
up a SMS system which accepted specially formatted input, and could
respond with useful guidance messages when encountering incorrect input.
You get access control since the phone has an associated IMEI. There's
lots of ocns of course, let me play devil's advocate with myself here
just for fun:

1. Lots of entries are numeric, obviating the utility of T9 which is in
my opinion one of the key drivers of SMS success
2. Can be annoying if the user doesn't know the input format
3. Necessitates the learning of a format to begin with
4. Is unlikely to support access control beyond IMEI, not counting ugly
hacks
5. Quality of service; no guarantee built into the SMS mechanism, would
have to be hacked on top, such as confirmation messages
6. Besides, doing it in MIDP means leveraging existing Java competencies
in the Mifos community
7. Not sure about this, but I'm guessing MIDP might scale better than an
SMS-based solution

But then on the other hand...

1. Absolutely low-tech (s/low tech/simple enough to work reaosnably
well/)
2. Everyone knows SMS
3. All cell phone networks support it (we're not piloting in North
Korea, I hope)
4. The inutility of T9 with numerical input is offset by the belief I
have (I have no stats to back this up) that a lot of people just don't
use T9
5. The phone doesn't have to support Java (I know java phones are cheap
and ubiquitous, but non-java phones are even cheaper, even if they're
disappearing)
6. When Mr. Phone User keeps two thousand SMS'es in his inbox, Java apps
can become unhappy with the reduced memory available.
7. It's probably just easier to write SMS gateway scripts than to
maintain a MIDP client

And then there's the possibility of doing things through a
computer-based Interactive Voice Response (IVR) system. You can do
funny things with an IVR such as Asterix. Scalability might again be an
issue here of course.

There, that ought to get the discussion rolling!


Youssef



On Wed, Jun 21, 2006 at 01:37:04PM -0400, James Dailey wrote:
>One of the items on our road map will be to explore the options for a
>front end that doesn't rely on a local generator, always on internet
>connection, and desktop machine.  The use case will focus on the remote
>agent in the field interacting with the client via the cell phone
>interface OR the use case of the client directly interfacing with the
>org over a cell phone.  
>
>That evolution is likely to point to cell phones, which are becoming THE
>UBIQUITOUS PLATFORM for computing in developing countries.  (as opposed
>to PDAs or some other special purpose terminal) 
>
>For instance, the Philippines has greater geographic cell phone coverage
>than the US, and mobile micro payment systems are starting to flourish
>there and in South Africa and Brazil, to name a few countries.  
>
>A number of pilot projects in Microfinance have worked on the process
>change that these technologies create, but none have been able to take
>this to a global marketplace of microfinance. 
>
>That Mifos should be able to enable such payment systems in tandem with
>client management is obvious, but what path we take is definitely up for
>discussion and debate.  
>
>The announcement below is significant from a Java perspective since this
>uses the Java SE, rather than the Java Mobile technologies (micro
>edition) which have - from my reading - hit a wall in terms of adoption
>by developers.  Both apparently require devices that are running MIDP
>http://www.onjava.com/pub/a/onjava/excerpt/j2menut_3/index1.html?page=2 
>
>So, this email is to start a short thread on the subject now, for us to
>return to in the next few months, as we look forward to our evolving
>Mifos platform. 
>
>James Dailey 
>
>
>
>
>
>________________________________
>
>	From: Mary Maguire [mailto:carine@savaje.com] 
>	Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 7:58 AM
>	To: James Dailey
>	Subject: Jasper Cell Phone Calls Java SE SavaJe puts Swing,
>Java2D Graphics into the hands of many
>	
>	
>
>	Please see the most recent news from SavaJe Technologies -
>detailing our continued growth.  If you prefer not to receive future
>updates from SavaJe, please respond to this email with unsubscribe in
>the subject line.
>
>	 
>
>	Thank you, 
>
>	 
>
>	Mary Maguire
>
>	Director of Marketing Communications
>
>	SavaJe Technologies
>
>	 
>
>				
>	Jasper Cell Phone Calls Java SE SavaJe puts Swing, Java2D
>Graphics into the hands of many
>
>
>	By Edward J. Correia <mailto:ecorreia@bzmedia.com> 
>
>
>	http://www.sdtimes.com/article/embedded-20060615-01.html
>
>
>	 
>
>
>	June 15, 2006 - If it's true that "the cell phone is tomorrow's
>desktop," as James Gosling notably remarked in an interview a few days
>before JavaOne last month, then the introduction there of a Java
>SE-based cell phone might be more than just fortuitous timing.
>
>	The Jasper S20, a triple-band GSM phone manufactured by Hong
>Kong-based Group Sense PDA, comes preinstalled with SavaJe Mobile
>Platform, an implementation of Java SE developed by SavaJe Technologies.
>The phone supports applications built for the Connected Device
>Configuration (CDC) and with the Advanced Graphics and User Interface
>Optional Package specified in JSR 209, the forthcoming specification for
>using Swing, Java2D Graphics and Imaging, and Image I/O in constrained
>devices.
>
>	According to John McCready, SavaJe's senior vice president of
>marketing, the advantages of developing to Java SE-based devices include
>easier application integration. "MIDP is a bolt-on solution," he said.
>"For example, if your app needs presence info from an instant messaging
>system, you have to install a second presence engine." Unlike MIDP, the
>SavaJe Mobile Platform is not an isolated runtime, he said. "With our
>approach, services are presented to any application. That's a huge
>strength for developers because it works more like a desktop
>environment."
>
>	McCready claims that Jasper is among the first phones to support
>CDC; Research In Motion's Blackberry devices use elements of CDC, but
>it's closed, he said. Jasper "is the first device [for which] developers
>can use NetBeans or other Java tools to build xlets," he said, referring
>to the name given to apps written for the CDC. SavaJe provides a free
>version of Sun's Wireless Toolkit that includes a Jasper device
>simulator and can deploy xlets to Jasper via USB cable.
>
>	Since its introduction in 2001, SavaJe's main focus has been on
>consumer markets. But McCready said a mobile Java desktop implementation
>also is beneficial to the enterprise. "Client applications written for
>J2EE will be relatively simple to convert using NetBeans," he said,
>offering a means to deploy existing apps without specialized skills.
>"[Mobilizing] a Java app customized for an organization is well within
>the skill set of those developers."
>
>	JSR 209 was approved in July 2005 by a 10-6 margin, with most
>dissenters (and even some supporters) commenting that Java2D should be
>separated from Swing. SavaJe disagrees. "The more specialization there
>is, the more fragmentation. We have to reduce and protect [ourselves]
>from the problem of having apps that aren't easily portable. We like the
>spec the way it is." JSR 209 went to final draft in April.
>
>	
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