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List: ltsp-discuss
Subject: Re: [Ltsp-discuss] Help in designing ltsp.github.io
From: Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha () gmail ! com>
Date: 2019-09-30 2:21:44
Message-ID: CAMucfLxNLBHV2OCMdf86Fat09ahc_p0DOvPJ2139ueh-opqDQA () mail ! gmail ! com
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Alkis,
Thanks for the quick and detailed response. It is in fact more detailed and
technical than I can understand :)
My problem is that I don't have multiple computers, so I cannot test LTSP.
In the past I have used VirtualBox for testing it, but it seems that with
iPXE it doesn't work (or maybe I am doing something wrong). So why not
support both booting methods (if possible).
I will continue the discussion on GitHub, but I have a feeling that its
issues do not replace completely a mailing list. Or maybe I am just on old
fashioned guy.
By the way, the creator and owner of ownCloud forked his own product and
created NextCloud. But maybe it is a completely different situation from
LTSP, so we cannot call this forking, but just a new version.
Thanks,
Dashamir
On Sun, Sep 29, 2019 at 6:23 PM Alkis Georgopoulos <alkisg@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Dashamir,
>
> this list is just for the old LTSP5 now; let's use github community
> issues for discussing the new LTSP:
> https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues
>
> I don't think the new LTSP can be called a "fork", as it's the official
> next version of LTSP 5, coming from the same developers/maintainers that
> worked on LTSP 5 in the last years.
> It's a complete rewrite, but not a fork; a fork is an unofficial
> diversion coming from some other team than a program's upstream team.
>
> Quick answers:
> 1. I deployed it to 6 schools so far; around 50 will have it till
> Christmas; and probably 1000+ will get it until next September with
> Ubuntu 20.04 or Debian Buster.
>
> 2. PXE is the protocol.
> PXE stack is the program that the BIOS/UEFI has for netbooting.
> iPXE is a program that either uses the existing PXE stack
> (undionly.kpxe/snponly.efi),
> or implements the PXE stack itself (ipxe.pxe/ipxe.efi/ipxe.lkrn),
> so that advanced features like menus and kernel loading are supported.
>
> I.e. iPXE doesn't replace PXE, as PXE was never able to load a kernel.
>
> It replaces pxelinux.0 (from the syslinux package) in LTSP5, because
> pxelinux doesn't support variables and its UEFI support was rather
> unstable in my tests. UEFI clients are much more frequent now, so UEFI
> support was a must for the new LTSP.
>
> Grubefinet could have been used instead, but it was too large, slow, and
> a bit more unstable than iPXE.
>
> If someone wants to use pxelinux.0 with the new LTSP, they just need to
> write a couple of lines in a pxelinux.cfg/default file, it's very easy,
> as now the kernel/initrd names are always the same, "vmlinuz" and
> "initrd.img".
>
> Let's continue in github issues. :)
>
> Cheers,
> Alkis
>
>
> On 9/29/19 6:59 PM, Dashamir Hoxha wrote:
> > Alkis,
> >
> > First of all the new LTSP seems to be great (more simple and modern than
> > LTSP5).
> > I think it was the right decision to fork it because the old LTSP has
> > too much legacy code, and it is not sure even if someone is still using
> > them.
> > Besides, moving to a universal collaboration platform like GitHub
> > (finally) is also an improvement on itself. (If you asked me I would
> > have suggested GitLab, anyway they are both great.)
> >
> > I would be interested in helping with the website, but right now I am
> > busy. After a couple of months maybe I will have more time. Anyway,
> > using a Jekyll template to build a GitHub page is a task that anyone can
> > do. By the way, GitLab pages are more advanced than GitHub, because they
> > allow you to use any static site generator that you wish, for example
> > Hugo, which is simpler and faster than Jekyll, or MkDocs.
> >
> > I have a few questions:
> > 1. Are the Greek schools using the new LTSP already?
> > 2. iPXE is of course better than PXE, but is it also supported by old
> > hardware (since it seems to be newer)?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Dashamir
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 25, 2019 at 8:01 AM Alkis Georgopoulos <alkisg@gmail.com
> > <mailto:alkisg@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Forwarded from https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21 (reply
> there)
> >
> > The old ltsp.org <http://ltsp.org> site is getting deprecated and
> > the new ltsp.github.io <http://ltsp.github.io>
> > takes its place.
> >
> > Currently, the new site is just a summary and a collection of links.
> > I'm
> > thinking we could use the github infrastructure to make it similar to
> > https://www.mkdocs.org or http://www.epoptes.org.
> >
> > We could also program a supybot to join our IRC channel and publish
> > http://irclogs.ltsp.org in a github repository.
> >
> > As I'm currently spending all my time on the LTSP code development,
> > help
> > on these areas would be greatly appreciated by the community. Anyone
> > interested may reply here (
> https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21)
> > or even talk to me on IRC or over email.
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________________
> > Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss
> > For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
> > <http://irc.freenode.net>
> >
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________________
> > Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss
> > For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
> >
>
>
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss
> For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
>
[Attachment #5 (text/html)]
<div dir="ltr">Alkis,<div><br></div><div>Thanks for the quick and detailed response. \
It is in fact more detailed and technical than I can understand :)</div><div>My \
problem is that I don't have multiple computers, so I cannot test LTSP. In the \
past I have used VirtualBox for testing it, but it seems that with iPXE it \
doesn't work (or maybe I am doing something wrong). So why not support both \
booting methods (if possible).</div><div><br></div><div>I will continue the \
discussion on GitHub, but I have a feeling that its issues do not replace completely \
a mailing list. Or maybe I am just on old fashioned guy.</div><div><br></div><div>By \
the way, the creator and owner of ownCloud forked his own product and created \
NextCloud. But maybe it is a completely different situation from LTSP, so we cannot \
call this forking, but just a new \
version.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Dashamir</div></div><br><div \
class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Sep 29, 2019 at 6:23 PM \
Alkis Georgopoulos <<a href="mailto:alkisg@gmail.com">alkisg@gmail.com</a>> \
wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px \
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi Dashamir,<br> <br>
this list is just for the old LTSP5 now; let's use github community <br>
issues for discussing the new LTSP:<br>
<a href="https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues</a><br> <br>
I don't think the new LTSP can be called a "fork", as it's the \
official <br> next version of LTSP 5, coming from the same developers/maintainers \
that <br> worked on LTSP 5 in the last years.<br>
It's a complete rewrite, but not a fork; a fork is an unofficial <br>
diversion coming from some other team than a program's upstream team.<br>
<br>
Quick answers:<br>
1. I deployed it to 6 schools so far; around 50 will have it till <br>
Christmas; and probably 1000+ will get it until next September with <br>
Ubuntu 20.04 or Debian Buster.<br>
<br>
2. PXE is the protocol.<br>
PXE stack is the program that the BIOS/UEFI has for netbooting.<br>
iPXE is a program that either uses the existing PXE stack <br>
(undionly.kpxe/snponly.efi),<br>
or implements the PXE stack itself (ipxe.pxe/ipxe.efi/ipxe.lkrn),<br>
so that advanced features like menus and kernel loading are supported.<br>
<br>
I.e. iPXE doesn't replace PXE, as PXE was never able to load a kernel.<br>
<br>
It replaces pxelinux.0 (from the syslinux package) in LTSP5, because <br>
pxelinux doesn't support variables and its UEFI support was rather <br>
unstable in my tests. UEFI clients are much more frequent now, so UEFI <br>
support was a must for the new LTSP.<br>
<br>
Grubefinet could have been used instead, but it was too large, slow, and <br>
a bit more unstable than iPXE.<br>
<br>
If someone wants to use pxelinux.0 with the new LTSP, they just need to <br>
write a couple of lines in a pxelinux.cfg/default file, it's very easy, <br>
as now the kernel/initrd names are always the same, "vmlinuz" and <br>
"initrd.img".<br>
<br>
Let's continue in github issues. :)<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
Alkis<br>
<br>
<br>
On 9/29/19 6:59 PM, Dashamir Hoxha wrote:<br>
> Alkis,<br>
> <br>
> First of all the new LTSP seems to be great (more simple and modern than <br>
> LTSP5).<br>
> I think it was the right decision to fork it because the old LTSP has <br>
> too much legacy code, and it is not sure even if someone is still using <br>
> them.<br>
> Besides, moving to a universal collaboration platform like GitHub <br>
> (finally) is also an improvement on itself. (If you asked me I would <br>
> have suggested GitLab, anyway they are both great.)<br>
> <br>
> I would be interested in helping with the website, but right now I am <br>
> busy. After a couple of months maybe I will have more time. Anyway, <br>
> using a Jekyll template to build a GitHub page is a task that anyone can <br>
> do. By the way, GitLab pages are more advanced than GitHub, because they <br>
> allow you to use any static site generator that you wish, for example <br>
> Hugo, which is simpler and faster than Jekyll, or MkDocs.<br>
> <br>
> I have a few questions:<br>
> 1. Are the Greek schools using the new LTSP already?<br>
> 2. iPXE is of course better than PXE, but is it also supported by old <br>
> hardware (since it seems to be newer)?<br>
> <br>
> Thanks,<br>
> Dashamir<br>
> <br>
> On Wed, Sep 25, 2019 at 8:01 AM Alkis Georgopoulos <<a \
href="mailto:alkisg@gmail.com" target="_blank">alkisg@gmail.com</a> <br> > \
<mailto:<a href="mailto:alkisg@gmail.com" \
target="_blank">alkisg@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br> > <br>
> Forwarded from <a href="https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21</a> \
(reply there)<br> > <br>
> The old <a href="http://ltsp.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">ltsp.org</a> <<a href="http://ltsp.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">http://ltsp.org</a>> site is getting deprecated and<br> > \
the new <a href="http://ltsp.github.io" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">ltsp.github.io</a> <<a href="http://ltsp.github.io" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ltsp.github.io</a>><br> > takes \
its place.<br> > <br>
> Currently, the new site is just a summary and a collection of links.<br>
> I'm<br>
> thinking we could use the github infrastructure to make it similar to<br>
> <a href="https://www.mkdocs.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://www.mkdocs.org</a> or <a href="http://www.epoptes.org" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.epoptes.org</a>.<br> > <br>
> We could also program a supybot to join our IRC channel and publish<br>
> <a href="http://irclogs.ltsp.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">http://irclogs.ltsp.org</a> in a github repository.<br> > <br>
> As I'm currently spending all my time on the LTSP code \
development,<br> > help<br>
> on these areas would be greatly appreciated by the community. Anyone<br>
> interested may reply here (<a \
href="https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/21</a>)<br> > or \
even talk to me on IRC or over email.<br> > <br>
> <br>
> _____________________________________________________________________<br>
> Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, \
goto:<br> > <a \
href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss</a><br> \
> For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on <a \
href="http://irc.freenode.net" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">irc.freenode.net</a><br> > <<a \
href="http://irc.freenode.net" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">http://irc.freenode.net</a>><br> > <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> _____________________________________________________________________<br>
> Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:<br>
> <a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss</a><br>
> For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on <a \
href="http://irc.freenode.net" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">irc.freenode.net</a><br> > <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_____________________________________________________________________<br>
Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:<br>
<a href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss</a><br>
For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on <a href="http://irc.freenode.net" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">irc.freenode.net</a><br> </blockquote></div>
_____________________________________________________________________
Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto:
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss
For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
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