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List: lilypond-user
Subject: Re: Terminology question
From: Carl Sorensen <c_sorensen () byu ! edu>
Date: 2021-06-21 19:34:30
Message-ID: F221E168-A418-4565-96E0-CC6019293C37 () byu ! edu
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😉
From: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonmark@ca.rr.com>
Date: Monday, June 21, 2021 at 12:21 PM
To: Carl Sorensen <c_sorensen@byu.edu>, "lilypond-user@gnu.org" \
<lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: RE: Terminology question
How more forte is his fortissimo than his forte given that a fortissimo may not be \
his forte?
From: Carl Sorensen [mailto:c_sorensen@byu.edu]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2021 10:52 AM
To: lilypond-user@gnu.org; Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonmark@ca.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Terminology question
His fortissimo varies between locations in the music.
Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S ®6 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>
________________________________
From: lilypond-user <lilypond-user-bounces+carl.d.sorensen=gmail.com@gnu.org<mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carl.d.sorensen=gmail.com@gnu.org>> \
on behalf of Mark Stephen Mrotek \
<carsonmark@ca.rr.com<mailto:carsonmark@ca.rr.com>>
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2021 11:38:25 AM
To: lilypond-user@gnu.org<mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org> \
<lilypond-user@gnu.org<mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org>>
Subject: RE: Terminology question
Aah, another fly in the ointment!
What do you mean by asking for my meaning?
"When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, ‘it means just \
what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.' 'The question is,' said Alice, \
‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.'" Through the Looking \
Glass - Lewis Carrol
M
-----Original Message-----
From: David Wright [mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2021 7:23 AM
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <carsonmark@ca.rr.com<mailto:carsonmark@ca.rr.com>>
Cc: lilypond-user@gnu.org<mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Terminology question
On Sat 19 Jun 2021 at 18:05:15 (-0700), Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote:
>
> I'll accept the burden.
> His plays with dynamic dynamics.
Apart from the typo (it's not a sentence), I suppose it might be interesting to know \
what you would mean by uttering it.
> From: David Wright [mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk]
> Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2021 5:38 PM
>
> On Sat 19 Jun 2021 at 10:53:40 (-0700), Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote:
>
> > Yes, yet what if the level was dynamic, i.e., changing, then dynamic would \
> > operate as an adjective - stating what kind?
>
> When I listen to the TV, the dynamic level varies between programmes
> and adverts. I think the burden is on you to construct a sentence that
> describes this, and which uses dynamic as an adjective. (Of course,
> any example will do.)
>
> > From: lilypond-user
> > [mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr.com@gnu.org] On
> > Behalf Of David Zelinsky
> > Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2021 10:12 AM
> >
> > Just a pendantic remark that, in the phrase "dynamic level", the word "dynamic" \
> > is still being used as a noun, though it is modifying another noun. Technically \
> > it is a "noun adjunct". It would also make sense to interperet it as the \
> > *adjective* "dynamic", but then "dynamic level" would mean a level that is \
> > dynamic, i.e. changing. That makes sense, but it's not what was meant in the \
> > present context.
> > -David
> >
> > Robert Gaebler <Bob.Gaebler@outlook.com<mailto:Bob.Gaebler@outlook.com>> writes:
> > >
> > > Thanks… happy to advise. I would call \ff a dynamic.
> > > "Dynamics" is an interesting word, described as "plural in form,
> > > singular or plural in construction" in Merriam-Webster. The plural
> > > construct usually refers to the entire range of variation of loud
> > > to soft within a piece. So you might say, "The dynamics in this
> > > etude are exquisite!" (Plural in construction.) But a conductor
> > > or music teacher might caution, "Now, watch the dynamics here!"
> > > (Singular in construction, admonishing caution in the
> > > _application_ of dynamic expression in this particularly difficult
> > > passage.)
> > > The \ff is a specific mark denoting a dynamic level to be applied
> > > at the point of usage. Note that "dynamic" is both an adjective
> > > and a noun. The mark in the score is referred to as a dynamic
> > > (noun). It denotes a dynamic (adjective) level to be expressed.
> > > I hope this helps.
> > >
> > > BoG
> > >
> > > From: Jacques Menu<mailto:imj-muzhic@bluewin.ch>
> > > Sent: Friday, June 18, 2021 1:00 AM
> > >
> > > BTW, another question came to me: in the LP notation manual, ‘dynamic' is \
> > > sometimes a noun as in ‘dynamics' and sometimes an adjective as in 'dynamic \
> > > mark'. So, is \ff a dynamic or a dynamics?
> > >
> > > JM
Cheers,
David.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Apple Color \
Emoji"">😉</span><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span style="color:black">From: \
</span> </b><span style="color:black">Mark Stephen Mrotek \
<carsonmark@ca.rr.com><br> <b>Date: </b>Monday, June 21, 2021 at 12:21 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>Carl Sorensen <c_sorensen@byu.edu>, \
"lilypond-user@gnu.org" <lilypond-user@gnu.org><br> <b>Subject: \
</b>RE: Terminology question<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> </div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">How \
more forte is his fortissimo than his forte given that a fortissimo may not be his \
forte?</span><o:p></o:p></p> <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Carl Sorensen \
[mailto:c_sorensen@byu.edu] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 21, 2021 10:52 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> lilypond-user@gnu.org; Mark Stephen Mrotek \
<carsonmark@ca.rr.com><br> <b>Subject:</b> Re: Terminology \
question</span><o:p></o:p></p> </div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" \
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">His \
fortissimo varies between locations in the music.</span><o:p></o:p></p> </div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span \
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black">Sent \
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><b><span \
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style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> \
lilypond-user <<a \
href="mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carl.d.sorensen=gmail.com@gnu.org">lilypond-user-bounces+carl.d.sorensen=gmail.com@gnu.org</a>>
on behalf of Mark Stephen Mrotek <<a \
href="mailto:carsonmark@ca.rr.com">carsonmark@ca.rr.com</a>><br> <b>Sent:</b> \
Monday, June 21, 2021 11:38:25 AM<br> <b>To:</b> <a \
href="mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org">lilypond-user@gnu.org</a> <<a \
href="mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org">lilypond-user@gnu.org</a>><br> <b>Subject:</b> \
RE: Terminology question</span> <o:p></o:p></p> <div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" \
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.5in">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt">Aah, another fly in the ointment!<br>
<br>
What do you mean by asking for my meaning?<br>
<br>
"When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, ‘it means just \
what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'<br> 'The question is,' said \
Alice, ‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.'"<br> \
Through the Looking Glass - Lewis Carrol<br> <br>
M<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: David Wright [<a \
href="mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk">mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk</a>] <br>
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2021 7:23 AM<br>
To: Mark Stephen Mrotek <<a \
href="mailto:carsonmark@ca.rr.com">carsonmark@ca.rr.com</a>><br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:lilypond-user@gnu.org">lilypond-user@gnu.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: Terminology question<br>
<br>
On Sat 19 Jun 2021 at 18:05:15 (-0700), Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote:<br>
> <br>
> I'll accept the burden.<br>
> His plays with dynamic dynamics.<br>
<br>
Apart from the typo (it's not a sentence), I suppose it might be interesting to know \
what you would mean by uttering it.<br> <br>
> From: David Wright [<a \
href="mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk">mailto:lilylis@lionunicorn.co.uk</a>]<br> \
> Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2021 5:38 PM<br> > <br>
> On Sat 19 Jun 2021 at 10:53:40 (-0700), Mark Stephen Mrotek wrote:<br>
> <br>
> > Yes, yet what if the level was dynamic, i.e., changing, then dynamic would \
operate as an adjective - stating what kind?<br> > <br>
> When I listen to the TV, the dynamic level varies between programmes <br>
> and adverts. I think the burden is on you to construct a sentence that <br>
> describes this, and which uses dynamic as an adjective. (Of course, <br>
> any example will do.)<br>
> <br>
> > From: lilypond-user<br>
> > [<a href="mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr.com@gnu.org">mailto:lilypond-user-bounces+carsonmark=ca.rr.com@gnu.org</a>] \
On <br>
> > Behalf Of David Zelinsky<br>
> > Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2021 10:12 AM<br>
> > <br>
> > Just a pendantic remark that, in the phrase "dynamic level", the \
word "dynamic" is still being used as a noun, though it is modifying \
another noun. Technically it is a "noun adjunct". It would also \
make sense to interperet it as the *adjective* "dynamic", but then \
"dynamic level"<br> > > would mean a level that is dynamic, i.e. \
changing. That makes sense, but it's not what was meant in the present \
context.<br> > > <br>
> > -David<br>
> > <br>
> > Robert Gaebler <<a \
href="mailto:Bob.Gaebler@outlook.com">Bob.Gaebler@outlook.com</a>> writes:<br> \
> > ><br> > > > Thanks… happy to advise. I would call \ff a \
dynamic.<br> > > > "Dynamics" is an interesting word, described as "plural \
in form, <br> > > > singular or plural in construction" in Merriam-Webster. \
The plural <br> > > > construct usually refers to the entire range of \
variation of loud <br> > > > to soft within a piece. So you might say, \
"The dynamics in this <br> > > > etude are exquisite!" (Plural in \
construction.) But a conductor <br> > > > or music teacher might caution, \
"Now, watch the dynamics here!" <br> > > > (Singular in construction, \
admonishing caution in the <br> > > > _application_ of dynamic expression in \
this particularly difficult<br> > > > passage.)<br>
> > > The \ff is a specific mark denoting a dynamic level to be applied <br>
> > > at the point of usage. Note that "dynamic" is both an adjective \
<br> > > > and a noun. The mark in the score is referred to as a \
dynamic <br> > > > (noun). It denotes a dynamic (adjective) level to \
be expressed.<br> > > > I hope this helps.<br>
> > ><br>
> > > BoG<br>
> > ><br>
> > > From: Jacques Menu<<a \
href="mailto:imj-muzhic@bluewin.ch">mailto:imj-muzhic@bluewin.ch</a>><br> > \
> > Sent: Friday, June 18, 2021 1:00 AM<br> > > ><br>
> > > BTW, another question came to me: in the LP notation manual, \
‘dynamic' is sometimes a noun as in ‘dynamics' and sometimes an adjective as in \
'dynamic mark'.<br> > > > So, is \ff a dynamic or a dynamics?<br>
> > ><br>
> > > JM<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
David.<br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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