From kstars-devel Sun Mar 06 00:56:49 2022 From: Akarsh Simha Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2022 00:56:49 +0000 To: kstars-devel Subject: Re: Problems with KStars 3.5.7 on macOS Message-Id: X-MARC-Message: https://marc.info/?l=kstars-devel&m=164652820512126 MIME-Version: 1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="--000000000000c0a60e05d98239de" --000000000000c0a60e05d98239de Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Mar 5, 2022 at 4:45 PM Bill Tschumy wrote: > Rob, > > Thanks for responding. I hated being critical because I=E2=80=99m sure m= any > people have worked really hard on this. But it just seems like many thin= gs > aren=E2=80=99t working as I=E2=80=99d expect. The extra downloads are on= e thing. I=E2=80=99m also > a bit surprised by the identification of stars. I will hover over a star > and I get =E2=80=9Cstar: 4.8m=E2=80=9D. I have to bring up the Info pane= to see what star > it is. Now maybe I can understand this with stars from the USNO catalog > that just have a long designation. But these are Hipparcos and HD stars. > Why aren=E2=80=99t they named in the hover display and in the status bar = (which > just says =E2=80=9Cstar=E2=80=9D). > > This is a good point. We could definitely display HD info on stars upon hovering. I think it's just something that did not occur to anyone. I don't know how / where we have HIP numbers. We probably only have HIP designations for stars from Tycho 2. Henry Draper is supported, but how we handle Henry-Draper numbers is complicated by performance constraints. > Also not sure how you are supposed to select things like open clusters to > get more information. Now sometimes I don=E2=80=99t even get the dotted = ring > around the cluster and I think KStars has forgotten that I=E2=80=99ve dow= nload the > NGC info. Even if there is the dotted ring, clicking in it doesn=E2=80= =99t seem to > select the cluster. How do I bring up info on this? > Right click > Details should be what you're looking for. Also, please use the Steinicke NGC/IC catalog. OpenNGC is not good as yet by any stretch of imagination. It's only that Dr. Steinicke wishes that his catalog be used for non-commercial uses only, which is incompatible with KStars' license. This is why we ship OpenNGC with KStars and supply Steinicke NGC as an add-on. I=E2=80=99m just wondering if something is really broken on my installation > (although I=E2=80=99ve installed on two machines with the same result). > Generally, we have fewer users and testing on MacOS. The primary clientele is astrophotographers using Ekos on Linux. I'm one of the few serious visual observers who exclusively uses KStars (and on Linux). For example, the help stuff works fine on Linux for me. KNewStuff (the UI to download new catalogs) is flaky on Linux. I don't know yet if the inline thumbnails work, because I've the HiPS overlay turned on. > Just so you know, I=E2=80=99m one of the primary authors of SkySafari so = much of > my expectations are the result of that and other planetarium programs I= =E2=80=99ve > used. > > Thanks for a wonderful product, SkySafari is incredible. KStars tends to be aimed at a different user-base and clientele. It's not surprising that basic features are not user friendly, because most of our users either live inside of Ekos or inside of the Observation Planner, and the basic stuff and eye-candy features don't get enough testing and love. I think this is a problem we must address as a team. Also we've accumulated about 3 decades of crufty code. It's only recently that Jasem has taken on a very strong lead in trying to get test-cases and documentation written for a lot of the features. At least now, we're reasonably confident that our core calculations are valid. > Bill > > On Mar 5, 2022, at 4:07 PM, Robert Lancaster wrote: > > Hi Bill, > > I can=E2=80=99t say I am a big fan of the =E2=80=9CDownload New Stuff=E2= =80=9D or =E2=80=9CGet New Stuff=E2=80=9D > system. This isn=E2=80=99t actually a part of KStars, it is a KDE packag= e that > KStars and other KDE apps use. It isn=E2=80=99t a problem that is just o= n MacOS, > it is an overall problem with that system in my opinion. But KStars > developers don=E2=80=99t have control over that code. I don=E2=80=99t li= ke the interface > myself. > > As for the help button, I don=E2=80=99t know much about that one, I haven= =E2=80=99t used > it before. I usually spend my time working on Plate Solving algorithms a= nd > making the astrophotography parts of the program better. But I also was > the one who first ported it to work on a Mac and I maintain the Mac > version. But even though I don=E2=80=99t know about this feature, I will > definitely look into it for you, that could mean something is missing in > the Mac bundle or there might be a bug. Let me see. > > I wouldn=E2=80=99t say Kstars is flaky really, it is highly sophisticated= fully > automated astrophotography suite, that has allowed me and lots of other > people to have many successful nights of imaging under the stars. But > sometimes there are bugs and we need people to test and find the bugs so > that we can work on making it better. We are all volunteer developers wh= o > contribute so that everyone can get a free and great program for taking > astrophotos. So please let us know and we can look into issues like this= . > We especially need more people to test the MacOS versions. > > Thanks, > > Rob > > On Mar 5, 2022, at 5:25 PM, Bill Tschumy wrote: > > I seem to be having numerous problems with KStars 3.5.7 on Mac. I=E2=80= =99ve > tried it on the latest macOS (12.2.1) as well as one two years old > (10.15.7). > > I=E2=80=99ve tried downloading the =E2=80=9CExtra Data=E2=80=9D, both fro= m the Startup Wizard and > from the Data menu item. I will install something and then later, when I > go back it says it is uninstalled. Some of the larger downloads will say > =E2=80=9CInstalling=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D but then al of the sudden say "Inst= all Again=E2=80=9D. Often if I > install again it will indicate it is installed. > > I have downloaded the USNO stars and initially is said it was installed. > However, if I go back now it says for me to install them. Yet if I zoom > in, I do see 14th mag stars so it really is installed. > > I have been trying to get the inline thumbnails to install, but they neve= r > show up in the chart. I did see them at one point while playing around, > but now they are gone. > > Clicking the Help button in the Configure window (shown by choosing > Preferences=E2=80=A6) causes the app to hang. > > Things just seem really flakey. > > Bill > > -- > Bill Tschumy > Otherwise -- Longmont, CO > www.otherwise.com > > > > > > -- > Bill Tschumy > Otherwise -- Longmont, CO > www.otherwise.com > > > > --000000000000c0a60e05d98239de Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Sat, Mar 5, 2022 at 4:45 PM Bill T= schumy <bill@otherwise.com>= wrote:
Rob,

Thanks for respon= ding.=C2=A0 I hated being critical because I=E2=80=99m sure many people hav= e worked really hard on this.=C2=A0 But it just seems like many things aren= =E2=80=99t working as I=E2=80=99d expect.=C2=A0 The extra downloads are one= thing.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m also a bit surprised by the identification of sta= rs.=C2=A0 I will hover over a star and I get =E2=80=9Cstar: 4.8m=E2=80=9D.= =C2=A0 I have to bring up the Info pane to see what star it is.=C2=A0 Now m= aybe I can understand this with stars from the USNO catalog that just have = a long designation.=C2=A0 But these are Hipparcos and HD stars.=C2=A0 Why a= ren=E2=80=99t they named in the hover display and in the status bar (which = just says =E2=80=9Cstar=E2=80=9D).

<= div>
This is a good point. We could definitely display HD inf= o on stars upon hovering. I think it's just something that did not occu= r to anyone. I don't know how / where we have HIP numbers. We probably = only have HIP designations for stars from Tycho 2. Henry Draper is supporte= d, but how we handle Henry-Draper numbers is complicated by performance con= straints.
=C2=A0
Also n= ot sure how you are supposed to select things like open clusters to get mor= e information.=C2=A0 Now sometimes I don=E2=80=99t even get the dotted ring= around the cluster and I think KStars has forgotten that I=E2=80=99ve down= load the NGC info.=C2=A0 Even if there is the dotted ring, clicking in it d= oesn=E2=80=99t seem to select the cluster.=C2=A0 How do I bring up info on = this?

Right click > Details = should be what you're looking for. Also, please use the Steinicke NGC/I= C catalog. OpenNGC is not good as yet by any stretch of imagination. It'= ;s only that Dr. Steinicke wishes that his catalog be used for non-commerci= al uses only, which is incompatible with KStars' license. This is why w= e ship OpenNGC with KStars and supply Steinicke NGC as an add-on.

I=E2=80=99m just wondering if something is= really broken on my installation (although I=E2=80=99ve installed on two m= achines with the same result).

= Generally, we have fewer users and testing on MacOS. The primary clientele = is astrophotographers using Ekos on Linux. I'm one of the few serious v= isual observers who exclusively uses KStars (and on Linux). For example, th= e help stuff works fine on Linux for me. KNewStuff (the UI to download new = catalogs) is flaky on Linux. I don't know yet if the inline thumbnails = work, because I've the HiPS overlay turned on.
=C2=A0
Just so you know, I=E2=80=99m one of the pri= mary authors of SkySafari so much of my expectations are the result of that= and other planetarium programs I=E2=80=99ve used.


Thanks for a wonderful product, SkySafar= i is incredible. KStars tends to be aimed at a different user-base and clie= ntele. It's not surprising that basic features are not user friendly, b= ecause most of our users either live inside of Ekos or inside of the Observ= ation Planner, and the basic stuff and eye-candy features don't get eno= ugh testing and love. I think this is a problem we must address as a team. = Also we've accumulated about 3 decades of crufty code. It's only re= cently that Jasem has taken on a very strong lead in trying to get test-cas= es and documentation written for a lot of the features. At least now, we= 9;re reasonably confident that our core calculations are valid.
<= br>

=C2=A0
B= ill

On Mar 5, 2022, at 4:07 PM, = Robert Lancaster <rlancaste@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Bill,

I = can=E2=80=99t say I am a big fan of the =E2=80=9CDownload New Stuff=E2=80= =9D or =E2=80=9CGet New Stuff=E2=80=9D system.=C2=A0 This isn=E2=80=99t act= ually a part of KStars, it is a KDE package that KStars and other KDE apps = use.=C2=A0 It isn=E2=80=99t a problem that is just on MacOS, it is an overa= ll problem with that system in my opinion.=C2=A0 But KStars developers don= =E2=80=99t have control over that code.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t like the inte= rface myself.

As for the help button, I don=E2=80=99t know much ab= out that one, I haven=E2=80=99t used it before.=C2=A0 I usually spend my ti= me working on Plate Solving algorithms and making the astrophotography part= s of the program better.=C2=A0 But I also was the one who first ported it t= o work on a Mac and I maintain the Mac version.=C2=A0 But even though I don= =E2=80=99t know about this feature, I will definitely look into it for you,= that could mean something is missing in the =C2=A0Mac bundle or there migh= t be a bug.=C2=A0 Let me see.

I wouldn=E2=80=99t say Kstars is flaky= really, it is highly sophisticated fully automated astrophotography suite,= that has allowed me and lots of other people to have many successful night= s of imaging under the stars. =C2=A0=C2=A0But sometimes there are bugs and = we need people to test and find the bugs so that we can work on making it b= etter.=C2=A0 We are all volunteer developers who contribute so that everyon= e can get a free and great program for taking astrophotos.=C2=A0 So please = let us know and we can look into issues like this.=C2=A0 We especially need= more people to test the MacOS versions.

Thanks,

Rob

<= blockquote type=3D"cite">On Mar 5, 2022, at 5:25 PM, Bill Tschumy <bill@otherwise.com&g= t; wrote:

I seem to be having numerous problems with KStars 3.5.7 on= Mac.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99ve tried it on the latest macOS (12.2.1) as well as o= ne two years old (10.15.7).

I=E2=80=99ve tried downloading the =E2= =80=9CExtra Data=E2=80=9D, both from the Startup Wizard and from the Data m= enu item.=C2=A0 I will install something and then later, when I go back it = says it is uninstalled.=C2=A0 Some of the larger downloads will say =E2=80= =9CInstalling=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D but then al of the sudden say "Install= Again=E2=80=9D.=C2=A0 Often if I install again it will indicate it is inst= alled.

I have downloaded the USNO stars and initially is said it was= installed.=C2=A0 However, if I go back now it says for me to install them.= =C2=A0 Yet if I zoom in, I do see 14th mag stars so it really is installed.=

I have been trying to get the inline thumbnails to install, but the= y never show up in the chart.=C2=A0 I did see them at one point while playi= ng around, =C2=A0but now they are gone.

Clicking the Help button in = the Configure window (shown by choosing Preferences=E2=80=A6) causes the ap= p to hang.

Things just seem really flakey.

Bill

-- Bill Tschumy
Otherwise -- Longmont, CO
www.otherwise.com





--=C2=A0
Bill Tschumy
<= div>Otherwise -- Longmont, CO

=


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