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List:       koffice-devel
Subject:    Re: [PATCH] Time stuff for date variable
From:       Nicolas Goutte <nicolasg () snafu ! de>
Date:       2003-09-20 1:42:25
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On Friday 19 September 2003 22:18, Thomas Zander wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 19, 2003 at 08:59:07PM +0200, Nicolas Goutte wrote:
> > On Friday 19 September 2003 09:34, Thomas Zander wrote:
> > > On Thursday 18 September 2003 00:27, Nicolas Goutte wrote:
> > > > The attached patch is for koffice/lib/kotext.
> > > >
> > > > As the date variable can do time display too, this patch adds:
> > > > - add the time codings in the custom combo box
> > > > - add a few date/time choices in the default combo box
> > >
> > > About this part:
> > >
> > > diff -u -r1.126 kovariable.cc
> > > - --- kovariable.cc	29 Aug 2003 13:13:33 -0000	1.126
> > > +++ kovariable.cc	17 Sep 2003 22:14:52 -0000
> > > @@ -221,6 +221,10 @@
> > >      listDateFormat<<"yyyy-MM-dd";
> > >      listDateFormat<<"dd/yy";
> > >      listDateFormat<<"MMMM";
> > > +    listDateFormat<<"yyyy-MM-dd hh:mm:ss";
> > > +    listDateFormat<<"yyyy-MM-ddThh:mm:ss"; // ISO 8601
> > > +    listDateFormat<<"dd.MMM.yyyy hh:mm";
> > > +    listDateFormat<<"MMM dd,yyyy h:mm AP";
> > >
> > > I read that (please correct me if I am wrong) as addition to the
> > > combobox, so the above time formats can be chosen as well.
> >
> > Yes, to show the user that date/time formats are possible. (I had to read
> > the code before finding that feature.)
>
> Hmm? The button that follows the 'add' label did not show you that?
> I know its far from a perfect GUI, though..

H'm, sorry, that was added by me. That is the half of this patch that is 
already commited. (The other half was not because I saw another problem in 
kovariable.cc.)

So, no, I did not see it from the "Add" combo, as there were not there.

And there is also another reason for those additonal date/time:
- creation date
- modification date
- printing date

These are not created by a dialog box, there have therefore not *any* custom 
format.

Second thing: when you modify a format by clicking with the RMB on a date, you 
do not have the dialog box either, so no custom format either.

Yes, this is something that could be fixed in the code. I have already lost a 
few hours trying to figure how to add a dialog box when clicking the RMB. (I 
have already a nice label "Change Format..." from another part of KoText.)
But RC1 is on Monday and there are plenty of other bugs around.

>
> > > If so, then I don't think you want that. Time/data formats are locale
> > > aware and adding DDMMYY type of dates are useless for the american
> > > crowds.
> >
> > I have only continued what was already there. All three date formats were
> > there (Europen, American, International), I continued.
>
> The user can select things like 'Month' and add that; no need to provide
> examples like you did.

See above for creation/modification/priting dates.

> If it is needed; then the GUI really needs fixing. But the examples really
> are unwanted since they don't work for many of the users.

Yes, there are needed. Yes, the GUI needs fixing. But it is too late...

>
> > Yes, for the future, it would be perhaps better, if the I18N teams could
> > make most of the date formats on their own. (OOWriter shows something
> > between. In the German version, you have European and international date
> > formats, but some with morning/afternoon (so with American background.))
> >
> > Good, "MMM,dd.yyyy..." is bad. I will change it to "MM/dd/yyyy..."
>
> Ehh, no. Read the next line;
>
> > > This is why the 'locale' entry is there.
>
> In short you want the user to alter his KDE global date if he wants to show
> a different time format.  Thats what the global setting is for in the first
> place.

So you want that a user use yyyy-MM-dd in KMail because he is working in a 
business that is internationaly oriented. That is defying the 
internationalisation of KDE. (People uses KDE in their language to write 
letters in other languages, English mainly.)

And personally, what I would want for a UI, is that if the text is marked as 
German I get "dd.MM.yyyy" as default and when as French "dd/MM/yyyy". (And 
then as second choice "yyyy-MM-dd" for both languages, as it is the European 
norm.) We are very far from that.

>
> > > This is why the 'locale' entry is there.
> >
> > But the locales do not show you the codes. So you cannot build your own
> > format on them. (Not counting that if your KDE speaks English, your
> > locale long date is in English even if you have chosen German in
> > KControl. (Bug #64041))
>
> Same thing as above; the GUI allows you to do this without typing.

Ooh, sure! Select years (4 digits), type -, select month (2 digits), type -, 
select day(2 digits), type space, select hours (2 digits), type :, select 
minute (2 digits).

And this only to have an international date/time, because as user you have 
select your normal national time.

> Again; the GUI needs to be fixed, its not intuitive.  But your 4 extra

Good, GUI is perhaps bad, but it is the GUI we have now. And the dialog is 
*documented* (yes, with picture), so we *cannot* change it. (Sure in KOffice 
1.4, you can change it again.)

> examples don't help, they only confuse the user.

No, if they were good. But you right 1/3 to 2/3 of the examples are not 
necessary for a user.

>
(...)

Have a nice day!
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