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List:       koffice-devel
Subject:    Re: [Bug 57415] First File Select Dialog should be able to turn off
From:       Thomas Zander <zander () planescape ! com>
Date:       2003-06-02 12:46:20
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On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 12:54:19PM +0200, David Faure wrote:
> On Monday 02 June 2003 11:04, Thomas Zander wrote:
> > I wish people that start to implement new features would first read the
> > mailing list archives.  This feature request has been discussed many
> > times and due to usability issues can't be implemented.
> > 
> > Its quite annoying to see that KWord has been praized for its usability
> > many times in the past 
> Has it? Certainly not for its startup dialog, if you read the bug reports.

It has, yes. Many reviews and bug reports start out stating that KWord is
the most usable word processor they know.  I hope you will forgive me that
I don't keep copies of such emails/magazines :)

> > and if I open KWord after not seeing the development 
> > for a year it has soo many usability bugs its nothing but frustrating.
> > 
> > The new open dialog that has been in development on the usability
> > mailinglist does not have this feature so this reporter is going to be
> > dissapointed when the new KOffice is released.
> 
> I'm sorry, but given the number of persons who asked for this feature,
> it would REALLY make sense that your 'startup dialog new generation'
> provide it. Especially since it's doable - given that the new one in CVS
> does it.

Technically everything is doable.  But that has never been the reason
to implement a new feature; has it? (because you can)
This _has_ been discussed on this list before many times and I really don't
want to start a discussion again.

The point (in a nutshell) is that if you don't get an open dialog the user
will never know he can get a template based document. Plus that he will not
get a very consistent user experience when pressing the 'new' button.


> Can we see how the "new generation" startup dialog looks like?
> Some screenshot was sent here but since then much discussion followed,
> so I assumed it's been improved.

Its not finished yet.  I believe you are familiar with the way the usablility
list works. They don't just replace code without consent.

> > Sorry to banter like this; but I feel strongly about some things (mostly
> > usability) and it amazes me that while KOffice (and KDE) is build via the
> > internet, soo many people fail to use that same internet for what it is
> > meant to be: information retreival and communications..
> 
> And it amazes me how every time someone contributes something he
> gets flamed more than congratulated. I like tnagy's new dialog a lot,
> and he has taken into account many requests about it from many people.
> "Drop it all, kde-usability has decided that it should look like this" isn't
> very nice IMHO.

If the dialog had a review on this list then some usability people could
have brought up issues before the real work has been done.
This is the main reason why more designer files should be used in KDE, its
easy to alter things without throwing away code.
I'm not saying that I just want to replace it with another for the sake
of replacing it!
I am arguing that the new dialog has several problems that make it worse
in some cases.  And I think we all agree that something new is only an
improvement if a) problems are solved b) no new problems are introduced.

I'm aware this is something that is very sensitive; many people don't really
look at a lot of issues many usability people like to look at.  So I am asking
that more people take the time to 'finish' their features.  The statement I
opened the first email with was more directed to the many new features that
are not done yet and provide a less-then-optimal user experience.

While I was coding on KWord a lot I also altered many little dialogs after
people added them;  I don't mean disrespect but please take my (and the
people from the usability list) expertise on dialogs and interfaces and
take care that new functionality has the best bug-free implementation.
Working together on this is what makes open source the stronger component.

-- 
Thomas Zander

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