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List: kde-windows
Subject: Re: kde installer in kdewin32 svn
From: "mark cox" <markcox () email ! com>
Date: 2007-01-09 6:43:03
Message-ID: e2c9b5730701082243j78b61c34k118214721f61d19d () mail ! gmail ! com
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it seems that document talks mostly about downloading and dependency
management. installing things in the correct places. Presenting a consistent
UI , setting the correct registry settings, dealing with user install
directories are all messy things. Either you can use the pascal script or
use a C++ dll, and call it from inno setup. either way you are saving
yourself a lot of code.
mark
On 1/9/07, Ralf Habacker <ralf.habacker@freenet.de> wrote:
>
> Peter Kümmel schrieb:
> > mark cox wrote:
> >
> >> I'm not sure why you are re-inventing the wheel. inno setup is mature
> >> installation software with many features and you can extend it to add
> those
> >> missing features. In my experience, installers on windows always turn
> >> out to
> >> be much more complicated than anticipated and because inno setup is
> mature
> >> it has already encountered and solved those problems.
> >> website: www.innosetup.com
> >>
> >> mark
> >>
> >>
> >> On 1/8/07, Ralf Habacker <ralf.habacker@freenet.de> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi all,
> >>>
> >>> there is an updated spec of the installer available on
> >>>
> >>>
> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt?rev=620682&view=auto
> >>>
> >>> .
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Any suggestions too or sombody want's to help coding beside Christian
> >>> Ehrlicher, who had contributed already some patches ?
> >>>
> >>> Ralf
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> > I use inno setup here:
> >
> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=29557&package_id=57553&release_id=425927
> > (the .exe). It has a pascal like syntax, and when
> > you wanna distribute all files within a directory and wanna call
> > some .bat files it is very convenient.
> > It has a build-in 7zip compression.
> >
> >
> > Wouldn't it be the simplest to just ship all files in one package.
> > When someone doesn't want some specific libraries he should
> > do it like a expert and use svn checkouts.
> >
> >
> Do you have read
> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt
> or verified kdelibs/share/apps/cmake/modules how much dependencies there
> are. The latter shows currently 47 find... entries, not included the
> additional tools Do you like to build all such packages by hand to be
> able to compile KDE applications. Additional only downloading all these
> files by hand require much time.
>
> The kde-installer supports you in the manner: 'okay, let's see which
> packages are required and where can I download it with one click'
>
> Your refered setup.exe size is 134 KB, a zipped kdelibs with debug
> informations is about 138 MB, unpackaged 616 MB. Do you like to
> recompile your installer exe every time a little patch is required ?
> Sure, you can create additional installers which contains updates, but
> this ends up like the windows update service, where you have many
> installed patches in your software panel.
>
> Then the next full update is out and you have to deinstall all patches
> by hand, which will create many confusions. I have used inno setup for
> KDE on cygwin and switched later to the cygwin installer in the long run
> because of problems with such updates.
>
> In the opposite using an online installer like the kde-installer is,
> you can create a new patch directory on the kde mirrors, upload some
> zipped files, add little dependency informations to the installer main
> config files located on this mirror and users are able to use this
> patches immediatly. This belongs also to snapshots.
>
> Inno Setup uses pascal and it might be not easy for non pascal users to
> learn all the required stuff. It is not very easy if you like to make
> more complicated things. Isn't it be more natural to use qt for a kde
> installer.
>
> In the long run there will be required to have standalone package like
> Jaroslav had done for kexi, but who will maintain this in this state of
> the project. Are we all not happy to use available resources as much as
> possible ?
>
> In my opinion the strategy is 'let's look where a binary packages for a
> required library or tool is and use it as available resource before
> recompiling it by myself.
>
> There may be packages, which are unusable for kde like the missing
> symbol problem with libxml2 on the gnuwin32 site for which Christian had
> compiled a replacement in his win32libs distribution.
>
> How do you be able to handle this with inno setup ? The kde-installer
> could assist you in this area too by adding a rule in the main server
> based config file to exclude the libxml library from gnuwin32 site.
> Instead it would use the related packages from the win32libs website.
>
> Ralf
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Kde-windows mailing list
> > Kde-windows@kde.org
> > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Kde-windows mailing list
> Kde-windows@kde.org
> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows
>
[Attachment #5 (text/html)]
it seems that document talks mostly about downloading and dependency management. \
installing things in the correct places. Presenting a consistent UI , setting the \
correct registry settings, dealing with user install directories are all messy \
things. Either you can use the pascal script or use a C++ dll, and call it from inno \
setup. either way you are saving yourself a lot of code. \
<br><br>mark<br><br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 1/9/07, <b \
class="gmail_sendername">Ralf Habacker</b> <<a \
href="mailto:ralf.habacker@freenet.de">ralf.habacker@freenet.de</a>> \
wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, \
204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> Peter Kümmel \
schrieb:<br>> mark cox wrote:<br>><br>>> I'm not sure why you are \
re-inventing the wheel. inno setup is mature<br>>> installation software with \
many features and you can extend it to add those <br>>> missing features. In my \
experience, installers on windows always turn<br>>> out to<br>>> be much \
more complicated than anticipated and because inno setup is mature<br>>> it has \
already encountered and solved those problems. <br>>> website: <a \
href="http://www.innosetup.com">www.innosetup.com</a><br>>><br>>> \
mark<br>>><br>>><br>>> On 1/8/07, Ralf Habacker <<a \
href="mailto:ralf.habacker@freenet.de">ralf.habacker@freenet.de </a>> \
wrote:<br>>><br>>>> Hi all,<br>>>><br>>>> there is \
an updated spec of the installer available on<br>>>><br>>>> <a \
href="http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt?rev=620682&view=auto">
http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt?rev=620682&view=auto</a><br>>>><br>>>> \
.<br>>>><br>>>><br>>>> Any suggestions too or sombody \
want's to help coding beside Christian <br>>>> Ehrlicher, who \
had contributed already some patches ?<br>>>><br>>>> \
Ralf<br>>>><br>>>><br>><br>> I use inno setup here:<br>> \
<a href="http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=29557&package_id=57553&release_id=425927">
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=29557&package_id=57553&release_id=425927</a><br>> \
(the .exe). It has a pascal like syntax, and when<br>> you wanna distribute all \
files within a directory and wanna call <br>> some .bat files it is very \
convenient.<br>> It has a build-in 7zip compression.<br>><br>><br>> \
Wouldn't it be the simplest to just ship all files in one package.<br>> When \
someone doesn't want some specific libraries he should <br>> do it like a \
expert and use svn checkouts.<br>><br>><br>Do you have read<br><a \
href="http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt">http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdesupport/kdewin32/installer/doc/readme.txt
</a><br>or verified kdelibs/share/apps/cmake/modules how much dependencies \
there<br>are. The latter shows currently 47 find... entries, not included \
the<br>additional tools Do you like to build all such packages by hand to \
be <br>able to compile KDE applications. Additional only downloading all \
these<br>files by hand require much time.<br><br>The kde-installer supports you in \
the manner: 'okay, let's see which<br>packages are required and where can I \
download it with one click' <br><br>Your refered setup.exe size is 134 KB, a \
zipped kdelibs with debug<br>informations is about 138 MB, unpackaged 616 MB. Do you \
like to<br>recompile your installer exe every time a little patch is required \
?<br>Sure, you can create additional installers which contains updates, but <br>this \
ends up like the windows update service, where you have many<br>installed patches in \
your software panel.<br><br>Then the next full update is out and you have to \
deinstall all patches<br>by hand, which will create many confusions. I have used inno \
setup for <br>KDE on cygwin and switched later to the cygwin installer in the long \
run<br>because of problems with such updates.<br><br>In the opposite using an online \
installer like the kde-installer is,<br>you can create a new patch directory on the \
kde mirrors, upload some <br>zipped files, add little dependency informations to the \
installer main<br>config files located on this mirror and users are able to use \
this<br>patches immediatly. This belongs also to snapshots.<br><br>Inno Setup uses \
pascal and it might be not easy for non pascal users to <br>learn all the required \
stuff. It is not very easy if you like to make<br>more complicated things. Isn't \
it be more natural to use qt for a kde<br>installer.<br><br>In the long run there \
will be required to have standalone package like <br>Jaroslav had done for kexi, but \
who will maintain this in this state of<br>the project. Are we all not happy to use \
available resources as much as<br>possible ?<br><br>In my opinion the strategy is \
'let's look where a binary packages for a <br>required library or tool is and \
use it as available resource before<br>recompiling it by myself.<br><br>There may be \
packages, which are unusable for kde like the missing<br>symbol problem with libxml2 \
on the gnuwin32 site for which Christian had <br>compiled a replacement in his \
win32libs distribution.<br><br>How do you be able to handle this with inno setup \
? The kde-installer<br>could assist you in this area too by adding a rule \
in the main server<br>based config file to exclude the libxml library from gnuwin32 \
site. <br>Instead it would use the related packages from the win32libs \
website.<br><br>Ralf<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>> \
_______________________________________________<br>> Kde-windows mailing list \
<br>> <a href="mailto:Kde-windows@kde.org">Kde-windows@kde.org</a><br>> <a \
href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/ \
listinfo/kde-windows</a><br>><br><br>_______________________________________________
<br>Kde-windows mailing list<br><a \
href="mailto:Kde-windows@kde.org">Kde-windows@kde.org</a><br><a \
href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows</a><br></blockquote>
</div><br>
_______________________________________________
Kde-windows mailing list
Kde-windows@kde.org
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-windows
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