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List:       kde-usability
Subject:    Re: KOrganizer does not have "Save" button
From:       Harijs Buss <harijs () info-shelter ! net>
Date:       2006-10-24 18:30:55
Message-ID: 200610242130.55169.harijs () info-shelter ! net
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First, let me apologize for being too emotional.  I understood your mail as 
plainly stating Save button (and option) as unnecessary in KMail and other 
components. Thank you for explaining your views.

On Tuesday 24 October 2006 17:23, Ellen Reitmayr rakstija:
> Before running all mad we should define what we are talking about: saving a
> single mail (file-save as) in kmail's main window corresponds to export
> (making it available in another context of use). 

No, saving single mail is only one particular possibility in KMail.  It is 
possible (and I use it alot) to mark groups of messages and save them in one 
file, even whole contents of folder.  Yes, it is closer to Export function, 
but anyway it is useful option. (For understandable reasons mail programs 
usualy have import options but very rarely export ones :-)

> However, in KMail, the label "Save as" doesn't tell the user what exactly
> is saved - the message, the folder, the inbox? 

"Save Folder As" would be nice option and wouldn't require knowledge of which 
directores and index files one need to copy to another location. Yep, just 
put this option in KMail, I can bet dollar against the cent that people will 
use it. For example, to store snapshots of their inbox or other folders onto  
another storage, e.g. USB memory or some cheap NAS connected to home network. 

> from your statement i guess would miss an option to save the mail, but
> you've never missed an option to save the folder or the inbox in kmail - 
> and that's what i was referring to. 

On the contrary, these would be wonderful options, thanks for mentioning them! 
For example, I would love to use new options like "Save Folder System" and 
"Save KMail Configuration" - currently I have no other choice as to find and 
save ~/.kde/share/config/kmail.rc , usually under some other name which 
refers to name and circumstances of saving. Version-independent "Save Folder 
System As" (which should save also related filters) would be sooo nice!   
Certainly in pair with "Restore Folder System From".

Look at Google Earth as positive example: you can not only Save but even Mail 
placemarks (starting from one individual placemark and up to whole My Places 
folder system) to another Google Earth user or to yourself, for archiving 
purposes. (Have you considered GMail as off-site backup for some data? :) 
And these options are used a lot!

> in short: the "container" - that is an inbox in kmail, a calendar in
> korganizer, a resource in kaddressbook - should auto save. 

They certainly should autosave, just because of human nature. But this 
absolutely does not exclude necessity for explicit "Save/Save As" buttons 
and/or options. 

> In this thread, the question was if it makes sense to offer an additional
> explicit save for containers. this question has not yet been decided on.

Yes, it would be very useful and nice to have explicit Save/Save As, specially 
in package with Restore/Restore From.  I definitely would use such options, 
be it KMail, Address book or whatever else. 

> yes and no. it depends on the context. from your second sentence i guess
> you refer to document storage?

Not only. Hope I could explain earlier in this letter. Metadata like 
containers and their relationships (e.g. filters) is not less worth 
saving :-)

Harijs
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