From kde-usability Fri Oct 24 18:22:32 2003 From: Sebastien Laout Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2003 18:22:32 +0000 To: kde-usability Subject: [Fwd: Re: (Real) Task Orientation in KDE 4.0 using KParts] X-MARC-Message: https://marc.info/?l=kde-usability&m=106701986004188 Arf ! I was sending this mail directly to Renato Machado and not at KDE Usability mailing list. It's now in KDE Usab. list : -----Message suivi----- > From: Sebastien Laout > To: Renato Machado de Sousa > Subject: Re: (Real) Task Orientation in KDE 4.0 using KParts > Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2003 13:45:39 +0200 > > Hi, > > (I haven't internet during week until end-nevember, it's why i'm long). > > > Yes, in writing my text I also noticed that multimedia/games do not fit > > in task orienting... I think they could remain as is. > > > > Perhaps put the file in the library, and _link_ (ln -s) it to its > > projects folders > > Hum... It's quite clutter IMHO. > - MIME types are numerous and this could confuse. > - And I often use links to... link :) files in other folders : if all > files are links it's too confusing. > - And if we sometimes use the "task-oriented interface" and sometimes > the "old-application-oriented interface" it's too confiusing : if I > delete a tesk-folder, I want to really delete the entire task : and not > have to browse all MIME folders to really delete theme... > - And if we put audio-video-whatever_else in a task folder it's because > we want it for the current project/task : if we want a particulare sound > for a presentation we doesn't want to have it in our "Music library". > > ]] It's my point of view. > > > > We can have a completly different desktop than today : no K|StartMenu > > > and... > > > The desktop BECOME the home folder or is deleted. > > > Or better : when we start our session the desktop provide several > > > options and we are asked what we want to do : > > > > I still think these options belong on a K menu. That's because I want to > > do many things (tasks) at once, and don't want to go to my desktop > > just to start another task. > > Hum yes I'm quite "revolutionar" :-) > What I was thinking is to replace the current kicker with a similare, > but task-oriented : > - At top of the screen we have the current opened task with opened files > (currently the opened apps in kicker : we just tranfert the notion of > apps in file notion) > At the top left of this new-kicker we have a button... similar to the > K-Menu, but in the spirit of the "task-oriented" : it show the > "new-desktop" that propose all task-options I've described. > Example of new "kicker" : > > [ [Home] [CurrentTaskName v] [ [File1.txt] [File2.png] ] [Monitors v] ] > > Explains : > > At session start the new-desktop is shown with start|continue task... > This screen can also be shown by clicking on the [Home] button ! > It replace on the same time the KMenu and the Home Folder. > - Home Folder : Because we think about files and open a task shown the > files PLUS the associated obejects (mails, contacts...) > - KMenu : Because application concept is diapparing and we also > open|create files. > > Then, when we have opened a task the folder of this task appears and we > open files, who appears in the "taskbar" : File1.txt or File2.png. > The corresponding app take all the screen. > We can return to the task-browsing by cliking on [CurrentTaskName v]. > [CurrentTaskName v] is also a comboBox and we can quickly switch between > tasks by clicking on the [v]. > Can be compared to the actual multiDesktop feature. > > As you see it's quite the same as the current kicker but too many > peoples doesn't use MultiDesktop and it isn't explicit. > > > that is why I think we cannot get rid of K menu/kicker. Just let them > > stay. But I liked the Idea of specific folders in applications for tasks > > (you forgot per task bookmarks on konqueror) > With this reorganisation, we can (but it's difficult to program). > We can move "usual tasks" in the [Monitor v] : if "play music" > task/monitor is selected, the button show the controls to > play/stop/go_forward... > > > I think these should BE (at least in some level) in KDE. Maybe not the > > revolutionary full desktop remake, but at least TASK support in > > applications (and a reorganizaation of the KDE menu... damn, even Office > > 97 puts "Open File" and "Creat File" in the Start Menu). Let me make a > > realistic list: > Yes, I agree that make a new DE is too hard. > So your view is the better to begin ! > After KDE will offer task-oriented features as you describe them it > could be good to make a new app, as Slicker, that replace kicker and > kdesktop with my view ; but not for the moment. > > > Easy: Reorganize K menu - get rid of all viewer applications, and get the > > One True viewer to rule them all Kparts. Add Open File, Create File kinds > > of tasks. > > > > Hard: Support Tasks in Apps - Involves creating a new abstract item > > "task" (much like a programming project, but cross-application), that > > downloads/files can be added to. Support opening a task, continuing it > > (like a microssession), archiving it. Easy intuitive "bookmark to task", > > "add contact to task", etc support in network apps. > Ok. I agree : more realistic :-D > > > No Idea about how can we do this: Task orient multimedia/entertainment > > (these are almost by definition outside tasks), remove the kicker (we NEED > > a global navigation/status panel), remove the K menu (we need somewhere to > > group apps/tasks, and the menu on the bottom left corner has proven its > > superiority until today. Getting a "selector"window is pretty much getting > > back to windows 3.1, which I hated since I got windows (even then I used > > to group all my programs in buttons on office toolbar, and just ignore the > > program manager) > Is my tasked-kicker not too win3.1 ? > It also show open files in the current task and kmenu need one click, > Home button need one click and is task oriented (but is this solution > good...). > > > I believe this orientation should be the focus of the KDE project (I don't > > really believe in forking, and this requires too much strcutural changes > > to be done in an app). I think the only thing we can do on short term is > > the "one true viewing application" (just a little work in Kviewshell will > > do), the "Open/Create Project" menu items (they just create a new folder > > in ~/projects and open a Konqueror window inside it. Perhaps we can put an > > icon "create new file" inside the folder, that will open a "create file" > > window...). > Ok. It's good. > I'm currently bussy with BasKet so I can't program it now. > And KDE need fiew re-arrangements to be done in KDE 4, as you sayed. > > > The rest, like adding task functionality to > > Koffice/Konqueror/KDEPIM/KDENetwork, is much structural, and cannot be > > done from the outside (this really changes the core of the KDE > > architecture, and I suspect it even can't be done before 4.0) > Mee too I don't believe in forking ! > > > Now, real programming is not something i can do right now. I am just a > > college student, with a project to complete and many exams. I just wanted > > to state this outloud in the KDE lists to try to collaborate > > "theoretically" to the development... > > > > Renato Machado de Sousa > > Best regards, > > Sebastien Laout. _______________________________________________ kde-usability mailing list kde-usability@mail.kde.org http://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-usability