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List:       kde-usability
Subject:    Re: KMenuEdit vs. direct manipulation [was: Re: RMB - once again]
From:       Sébastien_Laoût <sebastien.laout () tuxfamily ! org>
Date:       2003-08-12 13:38:40
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> > No, but I see 2 kind of people I know who use MS Windows: some people
> > know this functionality and use it. Others don't know it and don't
> > use it. The difference between these groups is that the first is much
> > smaller and have much more experience with computers than the second.
> > Of course this is only with people I know, but I think this will be
> > the same if you do some tests with a lot more people.
MS Windows isn't the same OS than Linux+KDE(orGNOME) : they have
different needs (see my axplains below).

> So, the group using direct manipulation of the KMenu probably likes it 
> and the other group ignores the feature.
When I've migrated from Windows to Linux, I've been frustrated to not
can drag and drop any desktop icons to the KMenu and any KMenu entry to
another KMenu place.
And start kmenuedit for a simple reordering is time useless. But : it
isn't often that peoples do that, so it isn't grave.

> > IMO the functionallity you suggests may exists but it should be
> > default dissabled because it's more "dangerous" than for example the
> > alternative ALT-RMB click way.
> >
> > > > o People will get disappointed if they click wrong and so change
> > > > their menu without knowing why it changed. (They will feel they
> > > > have no control and this will results in fear when using KDE.)
Yes, I also think it's dangerous if peoples click wrong and so change
their menu without knowing why it changed.

> On the contrary: If there is sufficient visual feedback, the users will 
> feel even more in control. Actually, is a user bothers to reorder the 
> menu, he will expect to be able to manipulate it directly. The reason 
> is that Windows implemented this feature since Win98 (I believe).
And WinXP add more visual feedback, that take a time of pleasure to
rearange the menu.
But : I think if the menu is well organized (as now : one deep level and
simplicity : contrary to Win, it isn't arranged by editors and doesn't
contain uggly readme, uninstall, visitMyCommercialSite...) the user
doesn't need to reorganize it (it just could want to add an item for a
recent non-KDE installed app (if the distrib doesn't add any entry for
it).
In Windows we NEED to rearange the fully and ugly StartMenu.

But why a KDE user could want to re-arange it ??? If he want, there is a
conception problem and we must fix it. The alone reason I want to d'n'd
an icon to the KMenu is to d'n'd a desktop icon...

Have you made any tests to know why users want to rearange there KMenu ?

With d'n'd in KMenu we introduce a problem : whereas a user quick click
on an item, he press the mouse, move it, and release, quickly...
Now, it's KMenu is uggly and he is disturbed.
If, by any chance, he know what he was done, it induce a new work for
rearange it as before.
A solution for it, is, when the user d'n'd an item FOR THE FIRST TIME, a
popup appears to say what he is doing and allow he to unactive this
feature to keep secured in the future.

> The use of direct manipulation eliminates much the necessary interface 
> knowledge a user needs to use KMenuEdit. Thus, the user can focus on 
> task knowledge, the tool (KMenuEdit) disappears and the users feels 
> like he is in control. The direct manipulation of the menu is therefore 
> more intuitive. 
> 
> Still, KMenuEdit might be useful for advanced features (as has already 
> been noted) but for reordering and similar simple tasks, direct 
> manipulation should be easier for users.
easier... for peoples that know what they do.
A very good visual feedback in not suffisiant.

I doesn't need to often personnalize my KMenu and KMenuEdit is great for
the little times I want to do it.
Why do you want to personalize your KMenu ?

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