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List:       kde-usability
Subject:    Re: KDE 3.0.2 Usability Study - First Steps
From:       Joseph Manojlovich <josephm () mail ! sis ! pitt ! edu>
Date:       2002-07-18 18:57:01
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On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
<OFFTOPIC>

> why don't you just put it in your .sig? think of all the typing you could've 
> saved by now. =/

Hehehehehe :-) I reserve my .sig for Simpsons quotes in general, but I'll
take this under advisement when drafting emails to KDE lists.

> what aproach did you take? if it is something beyond a "don't show this dialog 
> again" checkbox i'd be interested in trying it out...

Even worse. I just deleted the code that makes the dialog show up. It was
a proof of concept, not meant to be usable. For example, I can't create a
document from template at all with KWord. KSpread and Kivio, I'm willing
to make this sacrfice, since I personally don't see the point of templates
with those apps. And KPresenter, I was overjoyed to find out that I could
easily make the dialog only show templates there, which I consider ideal.

I'm already thinking about I intend for my own use to "properly" (really
big quotes needed here) handle this, when I get a free weekend, maybe in a
couple of weeks when the semester ends here.
 
</OFFTOPIC>

> he is speaking to internal consistency such that what happens once happens 
> everytime everywhere, thereby allowing people to learn the interface by 
> creatings habits. it wasn't about catering to habits learned elsewhere, in 
> fact he talks in his book about devices that try and accomodate the habits 
> people pick up from other systems (and why that usually ends up resulting in 
> poor designs) ... so i think you completely missed his point in that section.

I don't think I missed the point completely, I just think that the
examples Raskin cites are not applicable to the situation at hand. None of
the devices he mentioned had 99% of the market share (MS Windows and Apple
combined). That kind of momentum it hard to fight. I highly doubt Raskin
would advocate the forced relearning of basic UI, even with this issue
that he effectively pointed out the flaws in. Sometimes you just have to
go with the flow, so to speak, or at least provide the option for the
common folk. People don't want to learn a GUI, they just want to work.

> double clicking reduces the ability to form habits as one has to think about 
> whether to click or double click. some of us get to the point of it being 
> "natural", many (most?) never do.

I don't think I made myself clear on this. Sorry. I believe Raskin is
absolutely right that double clicking is bad UI. And I'm sure that if I
forced myself to use it, I would eventually love it. I just want the
option for myself and others who don't want to relearn the UI. Like,
Microsoft introduced their "web desktop" with single clicking many years
ago, but I have yet to see anyone actually using it, even after trying it.
Maybe I'm just hanging out with odd people, but it seems to me that once
people learn an interface, they're not eager to throw out all their habits
to gain .1 seconds by not double clicking.

An example, try KOrganizer from the HEAD branch. I've used KOrganizer for
years, but suddenly now they have implemented single clicking to create a
new appointment in the month view. Quite annoying, to double click (that
was the old action to make a new appointment) and have 2 appointment
dialogs show up. That's the kind of relearning that I don't like. I'm
being forced to think now, about how I click on the calendar, to make a
new appointment.

I don't think people should have to relearn icon clicking just because we
think they should.

The real point, are you talking about the removal of the double clicking
option for KDE (desktop, konq)? If not, then I'm done here :-) Sorry for
all the wasted bits... sigh, once again I'm going all nuts over one
stinking little option...

--
Joe Manojlovich
josephm@sis.pitt.edu
http://www2.sis.pitt.edu/~josephm
"I'm sorry, but I cannot divulge information about
 that customer's secret illegal account."





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