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List:       kde-panel-devel
Subject:    Re: Default touch screen edge gestures
From:       Martin_Gräßlin <mgraesslin () kde ! org>
Date:       2017-04-11 11:31:35
Message-ID: 7A4F7536-21CF-4980-907B-6484D0CACBFC () kde ! org
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Am 11. April 2017 13:13:11 MESZ schrieb Dan Leinir Turthra Jensen <admin@leinir.dk>:
> On Tuesday, 11 April 2017 11:32:18 BST Martin Gräßlin wrote:
> > Am 11. April 2017 11:23:01 MESZ schrieb Dan Leinir Turthra Jensen 
> <admin@leinir.dk>:
> > > Heyhey :)
> > > 
> > > i do rather like the idea of edge gestures, however i would also
> quite
> > > like
> > > to keep in mind applications here...
> > 
> > we discussed the proposed implementation at the affenfels sprint. Why
> did
> > you not raise this concern there?
> 
> i did mention it, but i realise my voice does not carry well.
> 
> > I explicitly asked for the "go for it!" prior to spending time on
> > implementing. Now coming up with additional requirements after the
> > implementation is rather unfair.
> 
> As you say, you have already worked on the implementation, and i must 
> confess to have not quite realised that (having been somewhat busy in
> other 
> areas). I retract my statement - while having the corners included, it
> is too 
> late to consider this now. Perhaps it might also, arguably, be too many
> 
> options for something which is supposed to be a type of sloppy
> interaction. At 
> any rate, departed trains and sailed boats and whatnot.
> 
> Arguing against myself, too, I guess it would make sense to perhaps
> have a 
> different set of gestures for when touch is a secondary input (touch
> enabled 
> laptops and whatnot), and for touch-first devices (phones, tablets...).
> It 
> would not be entirely out of step with what i have advocated with the
> whole 
> Gemini thing for a while now, that one size does not fit all ;)
> So, again, i retract my early morning comments, and quite entirely see
> your 
> reason for being displeased with what i am sure will seem as a drive-by
> info 
> drop (rather than the hopeful helpful comment it was intended to be,
> and which 
> obviously, in hindsight, it does not exactly manage).
> 
> Now, to try and be at least vaguely useful: Might i suggest that
> running 
> applications full screen would be something of a special case, and that
> in 
> such a case, the edge gestures might be expected to be different?
> Specifically, 
> it might be expected that the top (or bottom) edge would somehow
> function as 
> an escape function (say, present windows for example), while the
> remaining 
> edges are given to the full screen application?
> I mention this because, after using systems where this does not happen,
> it 
> is quite annoying when such accidental activations happen. Again, this
> is 
> only, specifically, for full screen applications, not for the general
> case, 
> where the rest of the system is visible.
> Hope that is an at least marginally useful comment on the topic.

I haven't tested it yet, but for mouse screen edges are reserved for fullscreen \
applications. As touch shares the screen edge code this should also be the case \
there. But as said: I haven't tested yet.

> 
> > > Specifically, other touch-focused
> > > UXes all
> > > have some kind of concept of edges given over to the applications
> > > rather than
> > > the system. Windows has the bottom edge, Android has both sides,
> Jolla
> > > has the
> > > top edge, and iOS has... both sides as well if i'm not too far
> > > mistaken.
> > > What i imagine we might do is to make it eight locations rather than
> > > four,
> > > to allow us to emulate various options (which i suspect would be
> very
> > > useful
> > > for experimentation as well). That is, the four edges, and the four
> > > corners.
> > > The most important point i am trying to make here is, though, that
> if
> > > you
> > > have a maximised application on screen, it seems to me that if we
> are
> > > aiming
> > > for convergence, might it not make sense to have similar gestures as
> > > the
> > > default for all the form factors our software runs on?
> > > 
> > > On Saturday, 8 April 2017 10:24:04 BST Martin Gräßlin wrote:
> > > > Hi Plasmates,
> > > > 
> > > > now that we have touch screen edge swipe gesture support both on
> X11
> > > 
> > > and
> > > 
> > > > Wayland we could define which actions to put on each edge.
> > > > 
> > > > My suggestion would be to put a sensible action on each of the
> four
> > > > actions.
> > > > 
> > > > Personal proposal:
> > > > 
> > > > *Left Edge:*
> > > > Window Switching as the default alt+tab theme is on the left side.
> > > 
> > > Also
> > > 
> > > > on Windows 10 this happens on the left edge.
> > > > 
> > > > *Top Edge:*
> > > > Present Windows as 4 finger swipe downwards on touchpad triggers
> > > 
> > > present
> > > 
> > > > windows.
> > > > 
> > > > *Bottom Edge:*
> > > > Desktop Grid as 4 finger swipe upwards on touchpad triggers
> desktop
> > > > grid.
> > > > 
> > > > *Right Edge:*
> > > > Application launcher
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > What I dislike about the proposal is: Present Windows and Alt+Tab
> are
> > > > kind of redundant. Given that a better default edge would be nice
> for
> > > > top edge. KRunner would be a nice fit as it's also on top, but
> it's
> > > > rather useless on touch.
> > > > 
> > > > The application launcher is rather disconnected in the default
> setup
> > > 
> > > if
> > > 
> > > > we swipe in from left screen. What I personally would prefer if we
> > > 
> > > could
> > > 
> > > > trigger the application dashboard. Of course we still don't have
> > > 
> > > working
> > > 
> > > > touch support in the application launchers, so if we go for that
> we
> > > 
> > > need
> > > 
> > > > fixing (same applies for alt+tab btw.).
> > > > 
> > > > So please comment and propose your own ideas.
> > > > 
> > > > Cheers
> > > > Martin


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