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List:       kde-look
Subject:    Re: "John Summerfield"
From:       John Summerfield <summer () OS2 ! ami ! com ! au>
Date:       1999-09-19 2:42:19
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> #if John Summerfield
> > OS/2 has a "program object." A clumsy name perhaps. It's similar to the 
> > KDE Launcher, but more configurable. For example, I can create a program 
> > object for EPM (my faviourine programmers' editor), specify that it's to 
> > start in a particular directory (where I store my C source code perhaps), 
> > that it's to open files who's names end in any of .C ,cpp, .h, .hpp, .rc 
> > etc. If I subsequently renmame or move epm (and I specified its full path 
> > name in the program object) the program object is updated automatically to 
> > reflect that name; I got caught once when I renamed something.exe to 
> > something.oxe and I created a new something.exe - the program's behaviour 
> > didn't change.
> 
> Sounds similar to .kdelnk files in KDE.

Aren't .kdelnk more like Windows shortcuts? Windows short cuts are passive 
pointers; if the data they point to is move, the shortcut's broken.

OS/2's program objects are active; they track the location of the data 
they point to. It sounds such a little difference, in practice it's an 
enormous one.

> 
> > A programmer can subclass (in almost any compiled language) a program 
> > object, a datafile, a folder and add custom behaviour. Contemplate a mail 
> > folder; drop a text file into it and it becomes a letter. Open its 
> > settings (properties) notebook and add address info and send it. Drop an 
> > empty text file and it opens your composer.
> 
> This kind of thing is certainly interesting, but I'm not sure if it's entirel
> y
> obvious to the user. Users still haven't learnt that they can work in a logic
> al
> way - dragging and dropping a file from a kfm window opened on an ftp site
> to one on the local drive just seems to escape them. They'll learn - and
> this kind of behaviour should become more accepted in future, though it


OS/2 users will expect to drag and drop everything. The capability is 
built into the WorkPlace Shell and only needs a few lines of code to 
activate.



> needs to be logical - everything should work the same way unless there's
> an obvious distinction between it and the rest of the system. For example,
> you can drop a file on the trashcan, and you're not asked whether you want
> to copy/move/link. The user understands that it's the trashcan and that
> the behaviour is 'special'.

OS/2 drag is a move unless modified with a shift key. I hate the "what do 
you mean dialogue." If you think it's necessary, allow users to turn it 
off.

Ipersonally like to turn off delete comfirmation for files but not 
folders; on OS/2 I can and have.

> 
> What I'd like to see in KDE 2 is more integration with standard components
> such as mail handling with KDE. I'm currently working on Empath, which is
> supposed to address this need. If you have any suggestions then please
> let me know. I'd be interested to learn more about OS/2 does things.


The OS/2 way would be to subclass the datafile object and give it the 
ability to mail itself. If you replaced the datafile object with one with 
this ability, just about every file on the system could mail do it.

Ideally the recipient software would know how to recover the file, but 
suitable MIME definitions should cope.


> 
> I'm not sure about the dropping-on-mail-folder idea, but I am interested
> to find better ways of composing a message than opening a mail client app
> and clicking 'compose'. There should, IMO, be such things as a button for
> the panel to do this, which you can drop files on - giving a composer with
> an attachment. Actually, this behaviour is already nearly possible in KDE 1.



As far as I know, nothing on OS/2 curently does this. However, I could do 
it on OS/2, and it would take me (a programmer) an hour so so.

I'd create a program object to run epm.
I'd program epm (in either REXX or E) to have the ability to add headers 
and solicit mailing information.
I could create a new menu, or extend an existing one to send the mail.
If I wanted to be flash (and spend more time), I could add a customised 
toolbar. I could (after some research, because I need to learn just how) 
add an ability to attach files.


I could, of course, do it with emacs too, but I've never come to terms 
with emacs.

If I found the need, I could customise the popup menu for the program 
object to add new items; perhaps one to display a catalogue of mail. On 
Warp 4 I can add a voice-navigation shortcut.


> 
> > OS/2 and KDE already share similarities. KDE has a pager; similar to 
> > OS/2's Launchpad. Both have single-button program launching. OS/2's has 
> > drawers (like gnome's pager). I happen NOT to like the windows-style 
> > unfolding menus; they are relatively slow to navigate and you always have 
> > to start again from the Start button or whatever. on OS/2 I  can have 
> > several launchpads; I can close any or all of them at will. A double-click 
> > on the desktop opens the master.
> 
> Ok, well kpanel is going to be replaced with kicker, which supports multiple
> instances and can be dragged around the screen.
> 
> Note that KDE already does something like 'drawers' - just add a folder to
> the panel, e.g. games, and it's done.

The launchpad has that too. It's not the same.

> 
> > There's a lot to like in both gnome and KDE; I  find both improvements on 
> > Windows (I and haven't yet decided which I prefer). However, I think that 
> > OS/2 can shed light on the way forward to both teams. If the developers 
> > know what OS/2 offers, they can more easily imagine ways to improve KDE>
> 
> So tell us !
> 
> A list of important features from OS/2 would be good.

You are asking me to write several hundred pages.

I notice that there's at least one IBM person following this list; perhaps 
they could use their influence to get some active support from IBM; some 
copies of CUA in the right hands would be a good start.


Actively soliciting OS/2 programmers on selected comp.os.os2.* (and 
comp.os.linx.* maybe) lists may turn up a few people with useful skikks 
and willing to join the project. There are quite a few OS/2 users moving 
to Linux; I myself have (mostly) moved because of the relative difficulty 
of locating applications I'd like to use; if I need to wun win32 software, 
I need win32. I don't like win32 overmuch, so except for when I need to 
use it I run Linux.




Like OS/2 comprises layers of software. One can run OS/2 with a CLI, like 
Linux without X, like DOS except it's multitasking. One navigates around 
fullscreen sessions using ALT-ESC.

Then there's Presentation Manager, about equivalent of X.

PM alone is pretty useless to a user; it provides tools to the programmer.

OS/2 ships with the WorkPlace Shell, but there's a featherweight 
alternative called "pmshell" that I've used. It's configured with text 
files and is a fairly simple program launcher.

The WPS is a SOM-based (SOM is CORBA-compliant and, I suspect, a model for 
CORBA). user interface. Everything is an object, almost all objects are 
persistent.

"The most significant application built on SOM is the OS/2 Workplace 
Shell. The Workplace Shell is implmented as a set of classes that are 
subclassed from SOM base classes. The full backward binary compatibility 
of SOm is clearly demonstrated by the Workplace Shell with the new release 
of SOM. The user can install a new release of SOM without affecting any 
existing Workplace Shell objects. There is no need to recompile or relink 
any of your existing Workplce Shell application."
"Object Oriented Programming using SOM and DSOM" Christina Lau pub Van 
Nostrand Reinhold (now John Wiley), 1994.

Christina's probably known (a least by reputation) by some others on this 
list; at the time she was a SOM specialist at IBM's Toronto Labs.


With SOM applications, one can replace an object in the line f inheritance 
and all descendents inherit the changed behaviour; IBM uses this in the 
OS/2 familiy of software to add sharing properties to WPSFolders and 
dataobjects.  Warp 4 uses this to add voice-navigation properties, even to 
programs created on previous versions of OS/2.




-- 
Cheers
John Summerfield
http://os2.ami.com.au/os2/ for OS/2 support.
Configuration, networking, combined IBM ftpsites index.

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