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List:       kde-kimageshop
Subject:    Re: Suggestions for a shortcut for Save Incremental Version
From:       David REVOY <davidrevoy () gmail ! com>
Date:       2011-06-17 20:53:21
Message-ID: 4DFBBEC1.7000807 () gmail ! com
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Hi,

I both like the 2 way to do save incremental :
The one Dmitry expose on the mail under is also a good method with 
advantages ;
The name of the final file don't change till the end of project. This 
can help for inclusion , or relative link with another program or in a 
multi-software workflow .For exemple I experienced an awesome test with 
the 2 'reload' option between Krita and Mypaint , working on the same 
file is a pleasure. On a project like Sintel, it can help also help 
workers to keep a GIT or SVN versionning of the file.

What I propose is in regards of this choice  is to keep the 2 systems ;

1. Option 'Save Incremental' as Pentalis already did ( I couldn't test 
but it looks and sound good from what's written, I like the way it use 
0~9 or a~z depending the filename ; smart ! )
For the shortcut ; maybe Ctrl+Alt+S  ( in PS , this one is for "save for 
web" ) ; but I know because of Ubuntu usage of 'Alt' this last keystroke 
became taboo in many apps. ( not for Blender or Gimp ) . btw, the F2 of 
the 'save as scrap' of Mypaint is also cool because it's a single key to 
press.
This option can be really good working on Storyboard too, thumbnail 
sketching and sketch in general.
For this option , I like the naming foo_001.kra.

2. For the other method Dmitry posted , a preference option ( as a 
checkbox in the preference menu ) to make the behavior of the normal 
'Save'  keep older versions and rename ( what Blender do also ) ; with a 
number box to change ( ex: keep 4 last versions / 8 last version or 
all~infinite version ). This option is more designed for artist who want 
to avoid overwritting errors on a single painting files ; or keep 
historical . I can make easier also the creation of a WIP.
For this option , I like the naming foo~001.kra.

I hope with the ~ and _  ; collision between files will not happen 
between the 2 system, if you think the design of a system like this is 
good.
( ex : the first 'save' over a the second page of a storyboard : 
foo_002~001.kra )

- David
____________________________
http://www.davidrevoy.com





On 17/06/11 21:21, Dmitry Kazakov wrote:
> Btw, some programs use a reverse way of dealing with revisions. They 
> rotate the existent files, so the newest version of the file is always 
> non-postfixed.
>
> Example:
>
> Before:
> file.kra      # 05.01.11
> file~1.kra  # 04.01.11
> file~2.kra  # 03.01.11
>
> After:
> file.kra      # 06.01.11
> file~1.kra  # 05.01.11
> file~2.kra  # 04.01.11
> file~3.kra  # 03.01.11
>
> That is just an idea. No insisting on it. I'm not sure about the pros 
> and cons.
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 10:07 PM, JL VT <pentalis@gmail.com 
> <mailto:pentalis@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     I recently added a new feature to Krita, reachable at the Save
>     Incremental Version entry in the File menu.
>
>     Operation:
>     --When clicked, a file called foo.bar is saved as foo_001.bar.
>     --If the file was already called foo_001.bar, it is saved as
>     foo_002.bar, and so on.
>     --If a file with the new name already exists, a letter is added to the
>     incremental version, for example, foo_001a.bar. Incrementations
>     preserve this letter, for example the next save incremental will save
>     it as foo_002b.bar.
>     --If the user manually used an incremental version scheme between 2
>     and 4 numbers, for example foo_01.bar or foo_1029.bar, it will be
>     respected, saving a foo_02.bar and foo_1030.bar file respectively.
>     --The command will never ask the user to confirm to save a file (it is
>     meant to save time), and by the principle of least surprise, it will
>     also never overwrite an already-existing file.
>     --If the algorithm reaches its end searching for alternative names
>     (exhausts options going all the way up to a "z" letter, as in
>     foo_009z.bar, it will show the user an error asking to save the file
>     manually with an adequate name).
>
>     The question I have is:
>
>     What would be a good default shortcut for this feature?,
>
>     since it's a feature meant to save time, it should have a default
>     shortcut. But I'm actually completely unfamiliar with the shortcuts we
>     use and I think artists have a better idea of what would be good.
>
>     I also CC'd Calligra-devel to inform them of the feature and hopefully
>     catch a couple suggestions (also, if there's interest to make Save
>     Incremental Version Calligra-wide, it's not hard to relocate).
>     _______________________________________________
>     kimageshop mailing list
>     kimageshop@kde.org <mailto:kimageshop@kde.org>
>     https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Dmitry Kazakov
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> kimageshop mailing list
> kimageshop@kde.org
> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop

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    Hi, <br>
    <br>
    I both like the 2 way to do save incremental : <br>
    The one Dmitry expose on the mail under is also a good method with
    advantages ; <br>
    The name of the final file don't change till the end of project.
    This can help for inclusion , or relative link with another program
    or in a multi-software workflow .For exemple I experienced an
    awesome test with the 2 'reload' option between Krita and Mypaint ,
    working on the same file is a pleasure. On a project like Sintel, it
    can help also help workers to keep a GIT or SVN versionning of the
    file. <br>
    <br>
    What I propose is in regards of this choice  is to keep the 2
    systems ; <br>
    <br>
    1. Option 'Save Incremental' as Pentalis already did ( I couldn't
    test but it looks and sound good from what's written, I like the way
    it use 0~9 or a~z depending the filename ; smart ! ) <br>
    For the shortcut ; maybe Ctrl+Alt+S  ( in PS , this one is for "save
    for web" ) ; but I know because of Ubuntu usage of 'Alt' this last
    keystroke became taboo in many apps. ( not for Blender or Gimp ) .
    btw, the F2 of the 'save as scrap' of Mypaint is also cool because
    it's a single key to press.<br>
    This option can be really good working on Storyboard too, thumbnail
    sketching and sketch in general.<br>
    For this option , I like the naming foo_001.kra.<br>
    <br>
    2. For the other method Dmitry posted , a preference option ( as a
    checkbox in the preference menu ) to make the behavior of the normal
    'Save'  keep older versions and rename ( what Blender do also ) ;
    with a number box to change ( ex: keep 4 last versions / 8 last
    version or all~infinite version ). This option is more designed for
    artist who want to avoid overwritting errors on a single painting
    files ; or keep historical . I can make easier also the creation of
    a WIP. <br>
    For this option , I like the naming foo~001.kra.<br>
    <br>
    I hope with the ~ and _  ; collision between files will not happen
    between the 2 system, if you think the design of a system like this
    is good. <br>
    ( ex : the first 'save' over a the second page of a storyboard :
    foo_002~001.kra )<br>
    <br>
    - David<br>
    <font color="grey">____________________________</font><br>
    <a href="http://www.davidrevoy.com"> http://www.davidrevoy.com</a><br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    On 17/06/11 21:21, Dmitry Kazakov wrote:
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTi=Dkx=_h7hZFqcjVzZ9kKe6LzvDyg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">Btw, some programs use a reverse way of dealing with
      revisions. They rotate the existent files, so the newest version
      of the file is always non-postfixed.<br>
      <br>
      Example:<br>
      <br>
      Before:<br>
      file.kra      # 05.01.11<br>
      file~1.kra  # 04.01.11<br>
      file~2.kra  # 03.01.11<br>
      <br>
      After:<br>
      file.kra      # 06.01.11<br>
      file~1.kra  # 05.01.11<br>
      file~2.kra  # 04.01.11<br>
      file~3.kra  # 03.01.11<br>
      <br>
      That is just an idea. No insisting on it. I'm not sure about the
      pros and cons.<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 10:07 PM, JL VT <span
          dir="ltr">&lt;<a moz-do-not-send="true"
            href="mailto:pentalis@gmail.com">pentalis@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
        wrote:<br>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
          0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
          padding-left: 1ex;">I recently added a new feature to Krita,
          reachable at the Save<br>
          Incremental Version entry in the File menu.<br>
          <br>
          Operation:<br>
          --When clicked, a file called foo.bar is saved as foo_001.bar.<br>
          --If the file was already called foo_001.bar, it is saved as<br>
          foo_002.bar, and so on.<br>
          --If a file with the new name already exists, a letter is
          added to the<br>
          incremental version, for example, foo_001a.bar.
          Incrementations<br>
          preserve this letter, for example the next save incremental
          will save<br>
          it as foo_002b.bar.<br>
          --If the user manually used an incremental version scheme
          between 2<br>
          and 4 numbers, for example foo_01.bar or foo_1029.bar, it will
          be<br>
          respected, saving a foo_02.bar and foo_1030.bar file
          respectively.<br>
          --The command will never ask the user to confirm to save a
          file (it is<br>
          meant to save time), and by the principle of least surprise,
          it will<br>
          also never overwrite an already-existing file.<br>
          --If the algorithm reaches its end searching for alternative
          names<br>
          (exhausts options going all the way up to a "z" letter, as in<br>
          foo_009z.bar, it will show the user an error asking to save
          the file<br>
          manually with an adequate name).<br>
          <br>
          The question I have is:<br>
          <br>
          What would be a good default shortcut for this feature?,<br>
          <br>
          since it's a feature meant to save time, it should have a
          default<br>
          shortcut. But I'm actually completely unfamiliar with the
          shortcuts we<br>
          use and I think artists have a better idea of what would be
          good.<br>
          <br>
          I also CC'd Calligra-devel to inform them of the feature and
          hopefully<br>
          catch a couple suggestions (also, if there's interest to make
          Save<br>
          Incremental Version Calligra-wide, it's not hard to relocate).<br>
          _______________________________________________<br>
          kimageshop mailing list<br>
          <a moz-do-not-send="true" \
href="mailto:kimageshop@kde.org">kimageshop@kde.org</a><br>  <a \
moz-do-not-send="true"  href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop"
            target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop</a><br>
        </blockquote>
      </div>
      <br>
      <br clear="all">
      <br>
      -- <br>
      Dmitry Kazakov<br>
      <pre wrap="">
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