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List:       kde-games-devel
Subject:    Re: [Kde-games-devel] Fwd: continuity between games
From:       Andreas Beckermann <b_mann () gmx ! de>
Date:       2001-04-05 13:28:11
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On Thursday 05 April 2001 01:05, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> Hi..
Hi

> > As (hopefully) KDE games are getting more complex and diverse it would be
> > very difficult to handle this. I would agree that the keyboard shortcuts
> > could be changed for the already existant ones (if someone with CVS
> > access volunteers), but there is clearly a difference between e.g.
> > KOffice (which must provide a consistent user UI) and usually games,
> > which are free to follow their own rules. I would even appreciate more
> > KDE games which don't look like KDE/Qt on every board and menu.
>
> i agree to a point.. control/input to the game is very game specific.
> however, it would be nice to be able to know that on board/card/turn based
> games, F2 (or Ctrl-N, whatever =) always starts a new game... that is just
> one example of what i ran into trying out the various games.
That is a problem of the games: most are (nearly) not maintained anymore. It 
is quite simple to do but someone has to do it (which needs some time if you 
are not familar to the code). KMahjongg is  a good example here: it was once 
crashing on startup (before KDE 2.0 IIRC) for quite some while - I fixed this 
in a more or less ugly hack and could not even reach the author by his email 
address...
Perhaps we need a new package maintainer or so?
Someone who can be contacted privately, like "if you have questions or 
problems with kdegames just contact the author or <insert name & email here>" 
on games.kde.org
I'm sure there are a lot of people who don't fill a bug report because it is 
"too public"

> i guess what i am saying is that the actions common across programs in
> kdegames should remain constant. where there are game-specifics involved
> (such as movement controls), obviously there  should be complete freedom.
That is quite easy to do (KStdAdction does most of the stuff) but someone has 
to do it...
I will have holidays for two weeks (I thought I would never like the school 
;)) so I will look if I can find the time

> > There is now another major difference: There are lots of cool
> > game/graphics libs, but an internal KDE game cannot depend on a lib
> > outside of its CVS tree, except standard ones. On the other side most
> > games don't link against kdelibs because games are desktop-independent,
> > at least fullscreen games, but also other ones. Think of Qt games, for
> > example. Maybe a rhetorical question: "How much KDE do games need?" -
> > There may be different opinions here.
My opinion: most games just cannot use much stuff from KDE. Where is the 
point to use KIOSlave in Quake?
libkdegames is trying to change this but things like OpenGL cannot be 
implemented easily by KDE. QT has an implementation but it is hardly used as 
there are problems with several graphics drivers, etc (ever tried to use 
NVidia drivers and an opengl QT? That's fun!).

> i see a distinction between KDE Games and external games, though. kde games
> are probably going to remain fairly simple/straightforward endevours that
> provide amusements on the desktop (think MS Hearts, or Solitaire). more
> complex games will probably not fit into the desktop metaphore as you point
> out, and are therefore probably  outside of the scope of KDE itself. there
> is a difference between KJezz and a flight sim =)
I agree

> i enjoyed watching the conversation on this list earlier on about creating
> a standard User, Network, Data, etc... set of classes that these simpler
> games could use... it would speed development, create a more uniform
> interface, etc...
>
> things i would _love_ to see made possible via a well thought outt
> game lib standard for simpler amusements include:
>
>   - migration of qt based games such as freelords over to the kde game libs
> simply because its easier on the developer of the game and so that they can
> be given a more consistent interface (when compared with the other desktop
> amusements)
That's the one main target of KGame.

>   - the creation of simple games aimed at children. i have a young son (1
> year old in 10 days! =)  and he loves the computer already, to my chagrin
> (esp. the mouse). we have Reader Rabbit type programs (for windows) that he
> enjoys, but under linux virtually all the other games for <5 yrs old (which
> aren't that many really, a dozen or so) are for Gtk or Gnome.  (check out
> linuxforkids.org to see the things available). where are the K* kids games?
> i think a standardized game lib set for kde would open up the possibility
> for the easy and quick creation of coherent games for the younger audience.
> this in turn would make KDE that much more attractive to those with younger
> people in the house.
Yeah - that would be cool!
Hey I remember a posting of a mother on kde-edu. Perhaps she's interested in 
such games?
/me is searching through lists.kde.org for an address

> wow. ok, i rambled a LOT. time to stop =)
ehh.. No! 
/me wanna here more and put some traffic on kde-games-devel ;)

CU
Andi
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