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List:       kde-devel
Subject:    Re: [Fwd: The "Killer" application]
From:       James Richard Tyrer <tyrerj () acm ! org>
Date:       2003-11-24 20:50:04
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Brad Hards wrote:
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> On Mon, 24 Nov 2003 17:07 pm, James Richard Tyrer wrote:
> 
>>I expected that I would get flamed about this so I posted it on 'Café'.
> 
> Which probably means I should have avoided it - but I'm willing to give you a 
> second chance (since you just got out of your 90 days in my killfile).
> 
> 
>>But, I received no comments.
>>
>>Any comment here or here, or here?
> 
> Dropping out koffice, which seems inappropriate. Prepare to drop out kde-devel 
> if this is mainly a KOffice focus proposal.
> 
> 
>>I may not have explained this well enough or perhaps you have to be able to
>>think outside the box to understand why this is at one a radical idea and
>>one that isn't really much different than what is currently available, or
>>what KOffice is supposed to be.
> 
> What is the goal? What is the intent of the "page" (or the "nest of pages") 
> when you have added the content? 

It is an abstract description of an XML data structure for a compound document.

> Is it supposed to be printed? 

Yes, as I said the 'reader' program can display it, or print it and the utility program 
can produce other file formats such as PostScript and PDF from it.

> Or does it 
> mainly live as an electronic document forever? Alternatively, what am I 
> supposed to use such a document for?
>
You use this XML format as the the file format for what replaces ALL of your content 
producing applications except for ASCII type editors.

> What happens if you print a page with transparency? 
> 
Well, you can't make paper transparent so the bottom layer is opaque.  But, actually the 
same thing would happen that normally happens if you print an image that contains 
transparency, the paper is the background.

> Is it meant to be mainly an office concept? 

Yes, as an Office concept -- to replace a suite of applications with a set of tools that 
all use the same file format.

> That is, would the content be 
> formatted text, spreadsheets, graphs, database reports, presentation slide 
> decks?

Yes, a page (what is attached with the corner) could contain both the description of the 
output and the embedded code.  So, in addition to just formatted text and images it could 
contain these other types of objects as well as others that you didn't mention.

> Also, why the limitation to a page only having one type of content?

Because that is the way software works now.  If you have more than one type of content, 
you actually have the different types of content embedded in a container.  But, this does 
not mean that the output would not appear that different types of content were merged. 
That is why layers can be transparent.
> 
> Overall, you appear to be describing a functional KOffice, with some arbitrary 
> limitations, and some special display options. 

Yes it is intended to be the basis for an Office type application that eliminates the 
*boxes* of individual applications.  Perhaps KOffice will have all of this and still 
maintain the illusion that it has separate applications.  But, I don't see any arbitrary 
limitations.  It is current applications that have limitations.

> I think you should be able to 
> build the system out of standard KOffice parts - all you need is the 
> framework viewer/printer.

That assumes that KOffice works correctly.  Currently, it is not a simple matter to embed 
a single spread sheet cell in a KWord document.  And -- this is the important distinction 
-- even if you can do that, you still have a KWord document with a spreadsheet cell 
embedded in it.  What I am saying is that you would have a Koffice document containing 
both formatted text and a spreadsheet cell -- a common file format (a container) for all 
of the KOffice applications.

I think that I managed to get KOffice 1.3RC1 to build overnight so I will have to try this 
on the new version and see if it will work.

--
JRT

 
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