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List:       kde-core-devel
Subject:    Re: Mac-menu is _not_ faster
From:       Michael Matz <matz () ifh ! de>
Date:       2000-04-28 16:55:58
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On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, mosfet wrote:

> Mac menu *is* faster, the reason why it was not faster for you is
> because your window was always in the same place (smack in the middle of
> the screen) and there was only one ;-)

If that would be the reason, then if I had moved the window in between, or
had used more windows (in my original mail I showed a scenario where it is
worse to have a mac menu with more than one window), mac menu would also
be faster for me, wouldn't it?

OK, if I had moved the window, nonetheless the relative position of the
menu in normal mode and the absolute position in mac mode would be the
same, whereever the window is. If one understands that in normal mode the
position of the menu is relative that makes no speed difference, esp. if
one assumes, that the main app window is not moved around every second,
and so the menu position is even absolut constant over a large time.

The other thing: more windows. While I understand, that in mac mode the
menubar is on the same place on top of screen, and therefore its not
possible to accidently activate another window which is unfortunately
possible to do in normal mode (I guess that is the reason you brought up
the case of multiple windows), mac mode has other issues with more than
one window (see my first mail). So that is also no argument for mac mode
(it also not one against mac mode either).

> Mac vs. windows menus has been timed on many occasions by people's
> whose entire job is studying UI's.

Then why has BeOS no Macmenubar? I know that this timing on many occasions
is brought up every time the Mac/other position-flamewar starts (not only
here) but I'm somehow not sure all these measurement where done in a
neutral environment (meaning no religious people (of either side) test no
apps specifically designed for this or that menu style)

> See "Fitts Law".

If I remember correctly the aspects of it having to do with menu style are
time to reach the item and safety to not select a thing one did not want
to select. For macmode the time is greater, but the safety also. I think
that both compensate each other, so that this is also no argument
specifically for mac menus.

Besides that the name "Fitts Law" is not really nice, because it depends
on many things which can't be calculated exactly. A law for me is
sth. like "If I add to a natural number another natural number, the result
is greater than both of them". Thats a law, and that's science. While UI
designing is, erhh, well... guessing? riddling? something like that.

Ciao,
Michael.

P.S: I think that mac menus are not better than normal menus. If there was
not the case of multiple windows used simultanous and illogicality (sp?)
of connection window<->menu, I would also think they are not worse than
normal menus. So I would not have a strong opinion for one or the other,
_if_ there were not the inconsistencies brought up in the other thread
specific to KDE. But that is not my point. My point is only the claim that
mac menus are somehow better than the other style.

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