From kde-core-devel Sun Oct 04 00:32:46 2009 From: =?ISO-8859-1?B?RGFy7W8gQW5kculz?= Date: Sun, 04 Oct 2009 00:32:46 +0000 To: kde-core-devel Subject: Re: RFC: System Settings categorisation overhaul Message-Id: X-MARC-Message: https://marc.info/?l=kde-core-devel&m=125461641514980 On Sat, Oct 3, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Aaron J. Seigo wrote: > On October 3, 2009, Darío Andrés wrote: >> > i'm not saying it couldn't be better, but let's be sure it gets done >> > better instead of trying and running the risk of probably ending up with >> > another not- great arrangement. >> >> That's why we are discussing it here, to come up with something >> better, which should be easy and discoverable. > > kde-core-devel is not a good place to find out how average computer users > perceive hierarchies of data that reflect the technical details of the system. > it's probably one of the worst, actually, because it is populated by deeply > advanced users who know all the details from the inside. > Ok... we choosed a bad place to discuss this.. This whole thing started on forums.k.o , may be it should continue there.. (lots of users, not so much devs) >> If it is done properly, it should help us to get something better; and > > i don't actually share the same confidence :) > Bah, to be sincere ... I don't have confidence at all about this ... nevermind. >> the "relearning" process should not hurt at all. > > it does hurt. every time we change this structure, we cause problems for > users. we hear about it. and it's the kind of problems that are really hard to > justify. it doesn't really provide any new advantage to these people, it just > discards their hard earned knowledge and exchanges it for another arcane set > of hierarchical modules. > > (and yes, search is a far better approach here :) > I like the search approach too >> > "Plasma Containments" is two jargon words put together. we should not be >> > using jargon _anywhere_ in our UIs that the average user is meant to go >> > through. in this case the name should be "Desktop Activities". it's a >> > moot point in thi case, though, as this panel doesn't belong there at all >> > (unless it's something other than what the name suggests?) >> >> Agreed. (I never liked "Plasma Containments", but it was the first >> name that come to my mind to describe it, sorry about that) > > what settings does this panel contain? > That KCM would be: http://www.notmart.org/images/netbooksettings.png ? ( http://www.notmart.org/index.php/Software/Trying_the_netbook_project_made_ ) >> > what's the difference between "Connections Manager" and "Connection >> > Settings"? what "Resources" are being "shared"? >> >> "Connections Manager" is just a dummy group for NetworkManager/WiCD , >> as I don't have such KCM I don't know how to group them nor name them >> properly. >> "Connections Settings" is the former "Network Settings" , proxy and >> other connection preferences, timeouts and so on. Ben pointed that it >> would make sense to merge this into "Connections Manager".. > > probably; use testing would help us with that. > >> "Resource sharing" should be "File sharing" > > probably a bit better; user testing would help us with that. > >> > is "Multimedia" really hardware? >> >> "Multimedia" includes the Phonon KCM which is about configuring audio >> and video output and settings, that kind includes hardware >> configurations ("to which speaker should X category sounds be >> played..."). but it is not strictly about hardware.. Where would you >> put it.. ? could it fit on "Workspace"? > > i don't think so as it isn't exclusive to the workspace. my point here was > that it's ambiguous, and so we really need to test this on actual people. > >> > would it make more sense to have Workspace / Applications / System >> > instead of Personal / W & A Behaviour / Hardware? >> >> Yes, as I said before it would make sense. The problem could appear >> when defining which settings is from Applications, which one is from >> Workspace and which one could be related to both. >> >> About the last category, are you suggesting to merge "Hardware" + >> "System Administration" ? > > perhaps; it would require user testing. :) > >> > i really think this needs to be done with a greater amount of usability >> > input and principles applied and with subsequent rounds of testing. >> >> Agreed. Should we redirect this to kde-usability ? > > yes and no. yes in that kde-usability is the right area, and no in that we > really shouldn't be discussing this on a KDE mailing list, we should be > testing people. > > these kinds of tests are actually pretty easy to do compared to other kinds of > usability research. we could each go out and test 3-5 people and have a great > sampling. Celeste could help set up some of the parameters. i think card > sorting would be perfect here. > OK, agreed on doing some user testing to resolve this.... (or should we just implement the "improved searching" function and forget all the mess about reordering SS ?) Regards Darío > -- > Aaron J. Seigo > humru othro a kohnu se > GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA  EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43 > > KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Development Frameworks >