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List:       kde-core-devel
Subject:    Re: Temporary KColorScheme change - hard-code some state colors
From:       pinheiro <nuno () oxygen-icons ! org>
Date:       2007-09-17 16:08:11
Message-ID: 200709171708.11885.nuno () oxygen-icons ! org
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A Monday 17 September 2007 17:01:05, Richard Dale escreveu:
> On Monday 17 September 2007, Matthew Woehlke wrote:
> > Richard Dale wrote:
> > > On Monday 17 September 2007, pinheiro wrote:
> > >> i think we should keep this feature turned off by defoult for the
> > >> moment until we get it in to ship shape condition, (the flikering and
> > >> the delay are real issues that we must deal with until we can realy
> > >> use it) AFIK its rely not big on cpu so ithink we should try it as an
> > >> option as i think many of the issues will be solved in the near
> > >> future..
> > >
> > > No, the hack to use the inactive control color palette for entire
> > > windows is just broken and can never be made to work properly.
> >
> > Have you reported this bug to TT so that QPalette::Inactive can be
> > removed in Qt5? Really, if it was so "fundamentally broken", don't you
> > think TT would not have added it in the first place, much less gotten it
> > working as well as it does? If this "it has bugs therefore it must be
> > fundamentally broken" attitude ran the world, we'd still be living in
> > caves.
> >
> > And yes, I completely disagree with the assertion that this "can never
> > be made to work properly".
> >
> > Also: get this "we can't make the text less contrasting because then it
> > is unreadable" out of your head. If you don't like that effect, *then
> > don't use it*. The default effect, if there is any, obviously will have
> > to be something that does not make this a problem. What I'm getting from
> > you is a lot of "it doesn't work for me, therefore no one should have
> > it".
> >
> > Btw, someone had said the font chooser is broken? I didn't see anything
> > wrong, anyone have a sample screen shot?
> >
> > > The visual metaphor you
> > > use for indicating the an individual control is inactive is different
> > > from the metaphor that you might want to use within the window contents
> > > to indicate the entire window is inactive.
> >
> > You still seem to think that QPalette::Inactive == widget does not have
> > input focus. This is not the case, (enabled) widgets without input focus
> > are active iff isWindowActive()==true.
> >
> > - QPalette::Active => isWindowActive()
> > - QPalette::Inactive => !isWindowActive()
> >
> > > We would need to use another mechanism entirely to do the effect that
> > > Mac OS X has - ie only change the color of the knob in a scroll bar and
> > > only just the color of selections. The inactive palette effect does far
> > > more than just that. I assume that the Qt style for Mac OS X must do
> > > this already, and maybe there is some api in Qt to allow it to work
> > > that we could experiment with using.
> >
> > This is the sort of thing that convinces me some people are totally
> > fixated on the intensity effect and don't even realize there are other
> > effects.
> >
> > We *might* be able to do exactly this (although it would be really,
> > really hard since there is intimate knowledge of the palette happening
> > here). I think what would work better is to use ColorTint, where the
> > tint color == QPalette::Window; this way QPalette::Window doesn't
> > change, but everything else "fades" into that color.
> >
> > I'm not saying that we *should* do that, just trying to make the point
> > that this isn't as inflexible as some people seem to think.
>
> The reason I call the inactive palette change a 'hack' is because I thought
> you were attempting to use the same api, and the same visual metaphor for
> both.
>
> But the QPalette docs say this:
>
> "If you create a new widget we strongly recommend that you use the colors
> in the palette rather than hard-coding specific colors.
> The color groups:
> The Active group is used for the window that has keyboard focus.
> The Inactive group is used for other windows.
> The Disabled group is used for widgets (not windows) that are disabled for
> some reason.
> Both active and inactive windows can contain disabled widgets. (Disabled
> widgets are often called inaccessible or grayed out.)
> In most styles, Active and Inactive look the same."
>
> So it does look like I'm wrong. All I can say is when I first tried this
> change, it made the KDE4 UI look like a dog's breakfast. Do we have any
> examples of styles where Active and Inactive don't look the same which are
> visually appealing?
>
> -- Richard

yes oxygen, :P you guys were loking at somthing that was completly off the 
chart, but it was couse we anted to see what it was doing :) can we please 
try to make this work, if it dosent i will be the frist one to say "lets get 
rid of this" until now we havent realy tried it. I rely think that if it done 
like in my mock its will be prety sutle and beter in term of usability, 
people wont probaly notece it.

-- 

core oxygen icon designer
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