--000000000000c358e706039cc25d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My response is interspersed. On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 9:51=E2=80=AFAM Paul Brown wro= te: > On Wednesday, 23 August 2023 17:04:04 CEST Ingo Kl=C3=B6cker wrote: > > On Mittwoch, 23. August 2023 16:55:25 CEST Niccol=C3=B2 Ve wrote: > > > > Postponing the deadline is not ideal, since there always will be > people > > > > jumping out saying "Why wasn't I told" "Was it discussed before" > again > > > > and again. > > > > > > Please note that the community was never told about this decision > before > > > yesterday, and it was never discussed publicly. > > > > https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2023q2/007656.html > > That link is denouncing the very thing, that all this was going on withou= t > the > wider community's knowledge . It hardly counts as an official announcemen= t. > > Besides, you have to stop assuming that because you published something > once > on some internal outlet, you are covered. > I have two hats on here - my KDE hat and my Kubuntu hat. The Kubuntu Tg channel (and IRC chan for that matter) are linked to the KDE infra in various ways. I don't know the tech details but I was an early Tg adopter years ago because it was the only thing that worked for real time communication one Akademy. I have since removed it from my phone. > > The people this is going to affect most (i.e. the Telegram end users) > don't > read mailing lists or know what a BoF is. Most people who are using our > apps > and are discussing them on Telegram are barely off of Whatsapp and > probably > don't even know what KDE is. > YES. I do mostly genealogy these days, and most people I interact with do not know (or have forgotten) what mail lists are. Of course I continue to love them, as I do IRC. But I don't use either one on my phone. I'm old enough that I don't care to use my phone for most things that younger folks want to do or have no other option. I never was able to get Matrix working right on my phone, and never even tried on my new one. IRC is awesome on my laptops; matrix never worked well there either, so I stopped trying. There is not enough time in life for everything. > > But they are your users. They are the ones you can ask to donate when you > need > resources to carry on developing your project, they make up the numbers > we > can quote when we want to convince would-be sponsors, they are the > "everyone" > mentioned in KDE's vision. > Please let's listen to Paul. He is bringing the voices of those otherwise nameless users whom we NEED into this conversation. To cut off many hundreds of thousands of users seems like slow suicide to me to KDE as a project. > > I am always surprised on occasions like this of how little some people > here > care. Other projects would be over the Moon to have this user base, but > here > it seems like it is perfectly okay to cut hundreds of users off completel= y > because of a technical issue. > > Very puzzling. > More than puzzling, it is distressing. What is the point of creating awesome software if we are going to cut adrift hundreds of thousands of users with a tenuous connection to us? Valorie, ex-CWG and still connected through the GSoC admin team and Kubuntu PS: Cutting off the Kubuntu Tg chans/rooms is just fine. > > Cheers > > Paul > -- > Promotion & Communication > > www: https://kde.org > Mastodon: https://floss.social/@kde > Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kde/ > Twitter: https://twitter.com/kdecommunity > LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/kde > --=20 she/her. "Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself running with them." - Marcus Aurelius --000000000000c358e706039cc25d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
My response is interspersed.

On Wed, Aug 23, 2023 at 9:51=E2=80=AFAM Paul Brown <paul.brown@kde.org> wrote:
<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">
On Wednesday, 23 August 2023 17:04:04 CEST Ingo Kl=C3=B6cker wrote:
> On Mittwoch, 23. August 2023 16:55:25 CEST Niccol=C3=B2 Ve wrote:
> > > Postponing the deadline is not ideal, since there always wil= l be people
> > > jumping out saying "Why wasn't I told" "W= as it discussed before" again
> > > and again.
> >
> > Please note that the community was never told about this decision= before
> > yesterday, and it was never discussed publicly.
>
> https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/k= de-community/2023q2/007656.html

That link is denouncing the very thing, that all this was going on without = the
wider community's knowledge . It hardly counts as an official announcem= ent.

Besides, you have to stop assuming that because you published something onc= e
on some internal outlet, you are covered.

I have two hats on here - my KDE hat and my Kubuntu hat. The Kubuntu Tg = channel (and IRC chan for that matter) are linked to the KDE infra in vario= us ways. I don't know the tech details but I was an early Tg adopter ye= ars ago because it was the only thing that worked for real time communicati= on one Akademy. I have since removed it from my phone.=C2=A0=C2=A0
The people this is going to affect most (i.e. the Telegram end users) don&#= 39;t
read mailing lists or know what a BoF is. Most people who are using our app= s
and are discussing them on Telegram are barely off of Whatsapp and probably=
don't even know what KDE is.

YES. I= do mostly genealogy these days, and most people I interact with do not kno= w (or have forgotten) what mail lists are. Of course I continue to love the= m, as I do IRC. But I don't use either one on my phone. I'm old eno= ugh that I don't care to use my phone for most things that younger folk= s want to do or have no other option. I never was able to get Matrix workin= g right on my phone, and never even tried on my new one. IRC is awesome on = my laptops; matrix never worked well there either, so I stopped trying. The= re is not enough time in life for everything.

But they are your users. They are the ones you can ask to donate when you n= eed
resources to carry on developing your project, they make up the numbers=C2= =A0 we
can quote when we want to convince would-be sponsors, they are the "ev= eryone"
mentioned in KDE's vision.

Please l= et's listen to Paul. He is bringing the voices of those otherwise namel= ess users whom we NEED into this conversation. To cut off many hundreds of = thousands of users seems like slow suicide to me to KDE as a project.=C2=A0=

I am always surprised on occasions like this of how little some people here=
care. Other projects would=C2=A0 be over the Moon to have this user base, b= ut here
it seems like it is perfectly okay to cut hundreds of users off completely =
because of a technical issue.

Very puzzling.

More than puzzling, it i= s distressing. What is the point of creating awesome software if we are goi= ng to cut adrift hundreds of thousands of users with a tenuous connection t= o us?

Valorie, ex-CWG and still connected through = the GSoC admin team and Kubuntu=C2=A0

PS: Cutting = off the Kubuntu Tg chans/rooms is just fine.

Cheers

Paul
--
Promotion & Communication

www: https= ://kde.org
Mastodon: https://floss.social/@kde
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kde/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/kdecommunity
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/kde

--
she/her.= "Dwell on the beauty of life. Watch the stars, and see yourself runni= ng with them." -=C2=A0Marcus Aurelius
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