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List: kde-community
Subject: Re: (low-frequency) mailing lists | suggestions & summary of prior thread
From: Shantanu Tushar Jha <shantanu () kde ! org>
Date: 2023-05-24 9:02:08
Message-ID: CABQ4Km8CT-TXS7NAt_+WAvkBu3ygQ8Pk_H+JpHx_eSnGOXktRg () mail ! gmail ! com
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Hi Joseph,
Thanks a LOT for summarizing the discussions, it really helps.
@Bhushan Shah <bshah@kde.org> Since there is a KDE India already on
Discourse[1], I propose we remove/archive the kde-india mailing list.
Cheers,
Shantanu
https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-communities/kde-india/19
On Tue, 23 May 2023 at 14:10, Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss <joseph@kde.org>
wrote:
> Follow-up discussion to the post "Inactive mailing lists".
>
> tl;dr There are three topics discussed here:
>
> 1. For mailing list admins: *Suggestions For Information To Add To
> Mailing List Descriptions*
> 2. For mailing list communities: *Moving Certain Groups To Discourse?*
> 3. For everyone: *Summary Of Prior Discussion About Inactive /
> Infrequently Used Lists*
>
> As always, the discussion is open for your feedback and ideas!
>
> _1. Information To Add To Mailing List Descriptions_
>
> If you are a list admin, consider adding the following to the mailing
> list description. This way subscribers are well-informed about the
> communication channels used for your project/community:
>
> * Other communication channels for this project and their intended
> use (e.g., for announcements, user support, live chat, etc.)
> * Relevant links for the project (e.g., website, wiki, etc.)
> * Intended scope for the list (i.e., what it is for / not for)
> * Policies regarding moderation, code of conduct, etc.
>
> For examples, see:
>
> * Energy-efficiency:
> https://mail.kde.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/energy-efficiency
> * Kde-soc: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-soc
> * Visual-design: https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/visual-design
>
> _2. Moving Certain Groups To Discourse?_
>
> Beyond typical forum functionality, Discourse integrates well with email
> and RSS. Something to consider for low-frequency mailing list groups:
> there may be projects and communities that benefit by officially moving
> communication to Discourse. Although I have no data to back up the
> claim, I suspect having users interact on a more active platform could
> generally increase engagement within KDE.
>
> A nice feature of Discourse is: for mailing list subscribers who wish to
> continue receiving posts in their mail clients, it is possible to follow
> discussions via RSS or by enable mailing list mode in Discourse. It
> takes some setting up; see below for more.
>
> A few language and country-specific communities already have made a move
> to Discourse. See:
>
> https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-com.munities/
> <https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-communities/>
>
> Some of these groups also have low traffic mailing lists. Unless current
> list subscribers also move to Discourse, there is the risk of fracturing
> the community as list subscribers are seperated from the people at the
> forum. In this case, archiving and closing the infrequently-used mailing
> list might be beneficial. Of course, that is for the list admin and
> relevant community to decide.
>
> Info about using Discourse with email and RSS:
>
> * Users can enable "Mailing list mode", which allows one to receive
> and respond to posts via email (i.e., just like a mailing list). By
> default, users receive posts to /all/ categories -- limiting posts to
> specific categories requires manually "muting" the other categories. See
> the community wiki for more detail, including how to mute categories:
>
> https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Mailing_List_Mode
>
> * Alternatively, one can follow specific categories, tags, etc. as an
> RSS feed. Again, see the community wiki for details:
>
> https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Following_RSS_Feeds
>
> _3. Summary: Prior Discussion About Inactive Mailing Lists_
>
> Here are some bullet points from the discussion about inactive /
> infrequently used mailing lists. For the full thread, go to:
>
> https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2023q2/007577.html
>
> * Some lists deliberately have archiving disabled, so an empty
> archive is not necessarily an indicator of no activity.
> * Some lists are primarily used for following bug reports (e.g.,
> *-bugs) or commits.
> * Subscribing to a low traffic email list is rarely something people
> notice, and the UI of mail clients rarely gets in the way. By contrast,
> the UI of e.g. Matrix very much gets in the way of staying in 200 low
> traffic channels.
> * Low email traffic does not mean subscribers will not answer
> appropriate posts sent to it.
> * Unless current subscribers also make the move to a new channel,
> moving discussion to a new platform risks separating the people who have
> answers (the current subscribed people) with the people who have the
> questions (the people redirected elsewhere).
> * For lists that are unquestionably no longer in use, please file a
> sysadmin ticket and they will get removed.
> * See this ticket for mailing lists that have been or will be removed
> as a result of the discussion: https://phabricator.kde.org/T16387
>
> Cheers,
> Joseph
>
> --
> Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss
> KDE Internal Communications & KDE Eco Community Manager
> OpenPGP: 8FC5 4178 DC44 AD55 08E7 DF57 453E 5746 59A6 C06F
> Matrix: @joseph:kde.org
>
> Generally available Monday-Thursday from 10-16h CET/CEST. Outside of
> these times it may take a little longer for me to respond.
>
> KDE Eco: Building Energy-Efficient Free Software!
> Website: https://eco.kde.org
> Mastodon: @be4foss@floss.social
>
>
>
>
>
--
Shantanu Tushar
shantanu.io
[Attachment #3 (text/html)]
<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>Hi Joseph,</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks a LOT \
for summarizing the discussions, it really helps.</div><div><br></div><div><a \
class="gmail_plusreply" id="plusReplyChip-0" href="mailto:bshah@kde.org" \
tabindex="-1">@Bhushan Shah</a> Since there is a KDE India already on Discourse[1], I \
propose we remove/archive the kde-india mailing \
list.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Shantanu</div><div><br></div><div><a \
href="https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-communities/kde-india/19">https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-communities/kde-india/19</a> \
<br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On \
Tue, 23 May 2023 at 14:10, Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss <<a \
href="mailto:joseph@kde.org">joseph@kde.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Follow-up discussion to the post "Inactive \
mailing lists".<br> <br>
tl;dr There are three topics discussed here:<br>
<br>
1. For mailing list admins: *Suggestions For Information To Add To <br>
Mailing List Descriptions*<br>
2. For mailing list communities: *Moving Certain Groups To Discourse?*<br>
3. For everyone: *Summary Of Prior Discussion About Inactive / <br>
Infrequently Used Lists*<br>
<br>
As always, the discussion is open for your feedback and ideas!<br>
<br>
_1. Information To Add To Mailing List Descriptions_<br>
<br>
If you are a list admin, consider adding the following to the mailing <br>
list description. This way subscribers are well-informed about the <br>
communication channels used for your project/community:<br>
<br>
* Other communication channels for this project and their intended <br>
use (e.g., for announcements, user support, live chat, etc.)<br>
* Relevant links for the project (e.g., website, wiki, etc.)<br>
* Intended scope for the list (i.e., what it is for / not for)<br>
* Policies regarding moderation, code of conduct, etc.<br>
<br>
For examples, see:<br>
<br>
* Energy-efficiency: <br>
<a href="https://mail.kde.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/energy-efficiency" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/energy-efficiency</a><br>
* Kde-soc: <a href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-soc" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-soc</a><br>
* Visual-design: <a href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/visual-design" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/visual-design</a><br>
<br>
_2. Moving Certain Groups To Discourse?_<br>
<br>
Beyond typical forum functionality, Discourse integrates well with email <br>
and RSS. Something to consider for low-frequency mailing list groups: <br>
there may be projects and communities that benefit by officially moving <br>
communication to Discourse. Although I have no data to back up the <br>
claim, I suspect having users interact on a more active platform could <br>
generally increase engagement within KDE.<br>
<br>
A nice feature of Discourse is: for mailing list subscribers who wish to <br>
continue receiving posts in their mail clients, it is possible to follow <br>
discussions via RSS or by enable mailing list mode in Discourse. It <br>
takes some setting up; see below for more.<br>
<br>
A few language and country-specific communities already have made a move <br>
to Discourse. See:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-communities/" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://discuss.kde.org/c/local-com.munities/</a><br> <br>
Some of these groups also have low traffic mailing lists. Unless current <br>
list subscribers also move to Discourse, there is the risk of fracturing <br>
the community as list subscribers are seperated from the people at the <br>
forum. In this case, archiving and closing the infrequently-used mailing <br>
list might be beneficial. Of course, that is for the list admin and <br>
relevant community to decide.<br>
<br>
Info about using Discourse with email and RSS:<br>
<br>
* Users can enable "Mailing list mode", which allows one to receive \
<br> and respond to posts via email (i.e., just like a mailing list). By <br>
default, users receive posts to /all/ categories -- limiting posts to <br>
specific categories requires manually "muting" the other categories. See \
<br> the community wiki for more detail, including how to mute categories:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Mailing_List_Mode" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Mailing_List_Mode</a><br>
<br>
* Alternatively, one can follow specific categories, tags, etc. as an <br>
RSS feed. Again, see the community wiki for details:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Following_RSS_Feeds" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://community.kde.org/KDE.org/KDE_Forums#Following_RSS_Feeds</a><br>
<br>
_3. Summary: Prior Discussion About Inactive Mailing Lists_<br>
<br>
Here are some bullet points from the discussion about inactive / <br>
infrequently used mailing lists. For the full thread, go to:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2023q2/007577.html" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-community/2023q2/007577.html</a><br>
<br>
* Some lists deliberately have archiving disabled, so an empty <br>
archive is not necessarily an indicator of no activity.<br>
* Some lists are primarily used for following bug reports (e.g., <br>
*-bugs) or commits.<br>
* Subscribing to a low traffic email list is rarely something people <br>
notice, and the UI of mail clients rarely gets in the way. By contrast, <br>
the UI of e.g. Matrix very much gets in the way of staying in 200 low <br>
traffic channels.<br>
* Low email traffic does not mean subscribers will not answer <br>
appropriate posts sent to it.<br>
* Unless current subscribers also make the move to a new channel, <br>
moving discussion to a new platform risks separating the people who have <br>
answers (the current subscribed people) with the people who have the <br>
questions (the people redirected elsewhere).<br>
* For lists that are unquestionably no longer in use, please file a <br>
sysadmin ticket and they will get removed.<br>
* See this ticket for mailing lists that have been or will be removed <br>
as a result of the discussion: <a href="https://phabricator.kde.org/T16387" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://phabricator.kde.org/T16387</a><br> <br>
Cheers,<br>
Joseph<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Joseph P. De Veaugh-Geiss<br>
KDE Internal Communications & KDE Eco Community Manager<br>
OpenPGP: 8FC5 4178 DC44 AD55 08E7 DF57 453E 5746 59A6 C06F<br>
Matrix: @joseph:<a href="http://kde.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">kde.org</a><br> <br>
Generally available Monday-Thursday from 10-16h CET/CEST. Outside of <br>
these times it may take a little longer for me to respond.<br>
<br>
KDE Eco: Building Energy-Efficient Free Software!<br>
Website: <a href="https://eco.kde.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://eco.kde.org</a><br>
Mastodon: @be4foss@floss.social<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><br><span class="gmail_signature_prefix">-- \
</span><br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" \
data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">Shantanu Tushar<br><a \
href="http://shantanu.io" target="_blank">shantanu.io</a></div></div></div>
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