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List: kde-community
Subject: Re: do you need www.kde.org write access?
From: Jaroslaw Staniek <staniek () kde ! org>
Date: 2018-03-08 9:46:19
Message-ID: CAOj7QQ0X35Fvg2Hs92j8q5Q34dBdDWA=_1_jBV3fxv7eHRyS3A () mail ! gmail ! com
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On 8 March 2018 at 09:51, Clemens Toennies <starbuck@netrunner-os.com>
wrote:
> On 08.03.2018 08:44, Boudewijn Rempt wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, 8 March 2018 07:57:27 CET Ben Cooksley wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 12:42 AM, Boudewijn Rempt <boud@valdyas.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 12:31:21 CET Sebastian Kügler wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> We have been working on a modernized website and backend for
>>>>> www.kde.org.
>>>>> The new site will do away with the old PHP custom CMS and will run
>>>>> wordpress instead.
>>>>>
>>>> Does that mean we'll lose our history, just like koffice.org history
>>>> from
>>>> the php times is only in subversion anymore and the wordpress (or
>>>> whatever it was) content is completely gone?
>>>>
>>> The current content of www.kde.org will still remain in Subversion at
>>> the very least.
>>> From my understanding the plan Sebas has mentioned envisages a
>>> temporary www-legacy.kde.org hostname being kept around until a full
>>> migration is completed.
>>>
>> So we _will_ lose proper access to KDE's release history. That's not good.
>> Pages like https://www.kde.org/announcements/ and everything it links to
>> should be kept up in eternity.
>>
>
> As far as i can see they will be all available, as they will be imported:
> https://www-backstage.kde.org/announcements/
>
That's very good the content is there. Question I would have to the www
community, are we going to keep exact the same URLs?
This it kind of important key since we link heavily, typically between blog
entry and announcement for example.
I've found our blog content, including blogs.kde.org or forums having dead
links to kde.org.
Technically, maybe URL rewriting would help for URLs that were in
standardized form.
Example of koffice.org as topic harder to handle but possible: currently it
100% redirects to calligra.org but it could redirect from koffice.org/X to
calligra.org/X maybe or calligra.org/koffice/X. Or rewrite the URL so
koffice.org/X would not redirect at all (it depends how we want to have it
presented).
Example link: to http://www.koffice.org/news/koffice-2-1-released/ from the
DOT: https://dot.kde.org/2009/11/24/koffice-21-released.
Missing. So relevant announcements for the history of computing, where we
have a place: software for Nokia n900... it's missing so also Wikipedia
references would be dead. The Wiki must to dig in archive.org now (see "KOffice
1.6 Released" at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KOffice).
Sibling topic is: dead URLs to relatively new software such as
https://download.kde.org/stable/koffice-2.3.3 (link from
https://marc.info/?l=koffice-devel&m=129901230231557). If we have no
resources to share the old files (and mirrors refuse that), maybe we could
at least have a landing page that lists possible options how to find the
archived tarballs?
Even more trouble is missing old image resources but this is lesson to
learn, we still have no ultimate solution IMHO, hash filesbased URLs get
created in share.kde.org and this seems to be fragile approach. I'd think
about at the topic as a matter of Freedom in content area. If we're not
solid here, what can we tell to next generation of contributors that say
"Facebook and YouTube just work".
Then we lost image content on blogs, even image tags seem to be somethow
lost: example https://blogs.kde.org/2004/02/24/one-little-feature, archived
at
https://web.archive.org/web/20040531171636/http://www.kdedevelopers.org:80/node/view/359
No images, no context... :(
I see the task is not light but preserving KDE history is worth investment
maybe even financial. Blogs are to me part of KDE's identity.
Good part of it is done nicely in the form of preserving the KDE 1.0 / 2.0
desktops.
--
regards, Jaroslaw Staniek
KDE:
: A world-wide network of software engineers, artists, writers, translators
: and facilitators committed to Free Software development - http://kde.org
KEXI:
: A visual database apps builder - http://calligra.org/kexi
http://twitter.com/kexi_project https://facebook.com/kexi.project
Qt Certified Specialist:
: http://www.linkedin.com/in/jstaniek
[Attachment #3 (text/html)]
<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 8 March 2018 at 09:51, Clemens \
Toennies <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:starbuck@netrunner-os.com" \
target="_blank">starbuck@netrunner-os.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><span class="gmail-">On 08.03.2018 08:44, \
Boudewijn Rempt wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px \
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> On Thursday, 8 March \
2018 07:57:27 CET Ben Cooksley wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 12:42 AM, Boudewijn Rempt \
<<a href="mailto:boud@valdyas.org" target="_blank">boud@valdyas.org</a>> \
wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px \
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> On Wednesday, 7 March \
2018 12:31:21 CET Sebastian Kügler wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> Hi all,<br>
<br>
We have been working on a modernized website and backend for <a \
href="http://www.kde.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.kde.org</a>.<br> The \
new site will do away with the old PHP custom CMS and will run<br> wordpress \
instead.<br> </blockquote>
Does that mean we'll lose our history, just like <a href="http://koffice.org" \
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">koffice.org</a> history from<br> the php times is \
only in subversion anymore and the wordpress (or<br> whatever it was) content is \
completely gone?<br> </blockquote>
The current content of <a href="http://www.kde.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">www.kde.org</a> will still remain in Subversion at<br> the very \
least.<br> From my understanding the plan Sebas has mentioned envisages a<br>
temporary <a href="http://www-legacy.kde.org" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">www-legacy.kde.org</a> hostname being kept around until a full<br> \
migration is completed.<br> </blockquote>
So we _will_ lose proper access to KDE's release history. That's not \
good.<br> Pages like <a href="https://www.kde.org/announcements/" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://www.kde.org/announceme<wbr>nts/</a> and everything it links \
to<br> should be kept up in eternity.<br>
</blockquote>
<br></span>
As far as i can see they will be all available, as they will be imported:<br>
<a href="https://www-backstage.kde.org/announcements/" rel="noreferrer" \
target="_blank">https://www-backstage.kde.org/<wbr>announcements/</a><br> \
</blockquote></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">That's very good the \
content is there. Question I would have to the www community, are we going to keep \
exact the same URLs?</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">This it kind of important key \
since we link heavily, typically between blog entry and announcement for \
example.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">I've found our blog \
content, including <a href="http://blogs.kde.org">blogs.kde.org</a> or forums having \
dead links to <a href="http://kde.org">kde.org</a>.</div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">Technically, maybe URL \
rewriting would help for URLs that were in standardized form.</div><div \
class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">Example \
of <a href="http://koffice.org">koffice.org</a> as topic harder to handle but \
possible: currently it 100% redirects to <a \
href="http://calligra.org">calligra.org</a> but it could redirect from <a \
href="http://koffice.org/X">koffice.org/X</a> to <a \
href="http://calligra.org/X">calligra.org/X</a> maybe or <span \
style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small;font-style: \
normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-s \
pacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal; \
word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline"><a \
href="http://calligra.org/koffice/X">calligra.org/koffice/X</a>. Or rewrite the URL \
so <span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small;f \
ont-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:40 \
0;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-spa \
ce:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline"><a \
href="http://koffice.org/X">koffice.org/X</a> would not redirect at all (it depends \
how we want to have it presented).</span></span></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default"><font face="monospace, monospace">Example link: to <a \
href="http://www.koffice.org/news/koffice-2-1-released/">http://www.koffice.org/news/koffice-2-1-released/</a> \
from the DOT: <a href="https://dot.kde.org/2009/11/24/koffice-21-released">https://dot.kde.org/2009/11/24/koffice-21-released</a>.</font><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default"><font face="monospace, monospace">Missing. So relevant \
announcements for the history of computing, where we have a place: software for Nokia \
n900... it's missing so also Wikipedia references would be dead. The Wiki must to \
dig in <a href="http://archive.org">archive.org</a> now (see </font><span \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace">"KOffice 1.6 Released" at <a \
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KOffice">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KOffice</a>).</span></div><div \
class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_default" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">Sibling \
topic is: dead URLs to relatively new software such as </div><div \
class="gmail_default"><font face="monospace, monospace"><a \
href="https://download.kde.org/stable/koffice-2.3.3">https://download.kde.org/stable/koffice-2.3.3</a> \
(link from <a href="https://marc.info/?l=koffice-devel&m=129901230231557">https://marc.info/?l=koffice-devel&m=129901230231557</a>). \
If we have no resources to share the old files (and mirrors refuse that), maybe we \
could at least have a landing page that lists possible options how to find the \
archived tarballs?</font><br></div><div class="gmail_default"><font face="monospace, \
monospace"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><span \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace">Even more trouble is missing old image \
resources but this is lesson to learn, we still have no ultimate solution IMHO, hash \
filesbased URLs get created in <a href="http://share.kde.org">share.kde.org</a> and \
this seems to be fragile approach. I'd think about at the topic as a matter of \
Freedom in content area. If we're not solid here, what can we tell to next \
generation of contributors that say "Facebook and YouTube just \
work".</span><br></div><div class="gmail_default"><span \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace"><br></span></div><div \
class="gmail_default"><span style="font-family:monospace,monospace">Then we lost \
image content on blogs, even image tags seem to be somethow lost: example \
</span><font face="monospace, monospace"><a \
href="https://blogs.kde.org/2004/02/24/one-little-feature">https://blogs.kde.org/2004/02/24/one-little-feature</a>, \
archived at </font><span style="font-family:monospace,monospace"><a \
href="https://web.archive.org/web/20040531171636/http://www.kdedevelopers.org:80/node/ \
view/359">https://web.archive.org/web/20040531171636/http://www.kdedevelopers.org:80/node/view/359</a></span></div><div \
class="gmail_default"><span style="font-family:monospace,monospace">No images, no \
context... :( </span></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div><div \
class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">I see the task is not \
light but preserving KDE history is worth investment maybe even financial. <span \
style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small;font-style: \
normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-s \
pacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal; \
word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">Blogs \
are to me part of KDE's identity.</span></div><div class="gmail_default" \
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:small">Good part of it is done \
nicely in the form of preserving the KDE 1.0 / 2.0 desktops.</div><br></div>-- \
<br><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>regards, \
Jaroslaw Staniek<br><br>KDE:<br>: A world-wide network of software engineers, \
artists, writers, translators<br>: and facilitators committed to Free Software \
development - <a href="http://kde.org" \
target="_blank">http://kde.org</a><br>KEXI:<br>: A visual database apps builder - <a \
href="http://calligra.org/kexi" target="_blank">http://calligra.org/kexi</a><br> \
<a href="http://twitter.com/kexi_project" \
target="_blank">http://twitter.com/kexi_project</a> <a \
href="https://facebook.com/kexi.project" \
target="_blank">https://facebook.com/kexi.project</a><br>Qt Certified \
Specialist:<br>: <a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/jstaniek" \
target="_blank">http://www.linkedin.com/in/jstaniek</a></div></div></div></div></div> \
</div></div>
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