From kde-artists  Sat May 24 03:37:43 2008
From: James Richard Tyrer <tyrerj () acm ! org>
Date: Sat, 24 May 2008 03:37:43 +0000
To: kde-artists
Subject: Re: [kde-artists] New Oxygen icon "page-zoom"
Message-Id: <48378D87.6020902 () acm ! org>
X-MARC-Message: https://marc.info/?l=kde-artists&m=121160032223491

Jakob Petsovits wrote:
> On Friday, 23. May 2008, James Richard Tyrer wrote:
>> Jakob Petsovits wrote:
>>> Other desktops and applications have fallback icons as well if 
>>> they use this icon name.
>> This icon name isn't in the standard and it does not conform to the
>>  standard.  So that probability is very low.
> 
> Right, but note that "zoom" is not in the spec as well.

Yes, that is correct.  But, KDE will install Oxygen "zoom" if it exists
and then if a third party icon theme is used that doesn't have
"zoom-fit-width" (which isn't in the theme either) we will have
something for fallback.  I'm sorry if that wasn't clear.

> Just because it's technically possible to use it as icon name doesn't
>  mean we should do so, and stuff that isn't specified (including the 
> zoom tool icon) should either a) get into the spec, or if they're not
>  important enough, b) agreed upon with app developers outside the 
> spec.

But my point is that for an icon which already exists that "zoom" is the
best name and it is the logical name.

	viewmag+	->	zoom-in
	viewmag-	->	zoom-out
	viewmag		->	??

Yes, this is like an IQ test.  Clearly the answer is: "zoom"

BUT, your answer is: "page-zoom".  I see no logical reason for this 
name.  It does not fit in with the the standard!  Why come up with that 
name when the above should be obvious to anyone?

>>> If for example Gimp wants to use page-zoom, they'd probably put 
>>> their version into hicolor (as it's not included in the spec) 
>>> which is used as fallback in case any 3rd party theme doesn't 
>>> provide the icon.
>> Right and we need an icon named "zoom" in case a third party 
>> doesn't provide an icon named "zoom-fit-height".  This isn't going 
>> to fall back to "page-zoom"!
> 
> And it shouldn't fall back to the zoom tool icon, either. No icon can
>  possibly provide "zoom to fit", "zoom to height", "zoom to window", 
> "zoom in", "zoom out" and "zoom to original size" at the same time. 
> Those are *different* icons, and the zoom tool is another different 
> one, not a more generic version of the mentioned ones.

It isn't "generic", it is the "general" case which is a slightly different
concept.

> There can't be a sensible fallback icon at "zoom", because different
> purposes cannot possibly be covered by one single icon.
> 
> QED
> 
> P.S.: The spec doesn't require us to provide *any* icon that is not 
> directly listed in the spec. So the spec doesn't require us to 
> provide "zoom".
> 
Quite true but totally irrelevant.  We have icons, they need to have a name.

You have picked a name out of left filed as wit were, which does not fit 
in with the standard and for which I see no logical reason.

So, I hold up all additional renaming of icons waiting for this one 
stupid issue.  You didn't rename the icons in KDEArtWork but you are 
going to prevent anyone else from doing it unless they do it your way. 
This is not reasonable.  So, I know remember why I gave up.

-- 
JRT
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