'Re: [orca-list] Accessibility in Plasmas new notification system, QAccessible doesnt provide "NOTIFI'

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List:       kde-accessibility
Subject:    Re: [orca-list] Accessibility in Plasmas new notification system, QAccessible doesnt provide "NOTIFI
From:       Joanmarie Diggs <jdiggs () igalia ! com>
Date:       2019-06-06 14:28:40
Message-ID: d740e9d1-a34f-e3c5-8be1-4c0cd843d7f8 () igalia ! com
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Cool. Thanks! So.... According to [1], QAccessible::HelpBalloon maps to
ATSPI_ROLE_DIALOG. That was the only real candidate to me from your
temp-workaround list. But a dialog should emit window events and one of
its children should claim focus. So I don't see that as being an option
for this problem.

That said, is a HelpBalloon really a dialog? (i.e. a window-like thing
with child widgets which claim focus) If it's not, is there any chance
it's more like a notification? (i.e. something which pops up to display
info without actually claiming focus). If the answer is yes, it's more
like a notification, then perhaps the fix is to change that mapping. If
the answer is no, then.... I got nothing (other than to add a new
notification role to QAccessible::Role).

--joanie

[1]
https://github.com/qt/qtbase/blob/1269f9cd16485d0081f5027ffec914bcb696f658/src/platformsupport/linuxaccessibility/bridge.cpp#L182

On 6/6/19 10:05 AM, chrys@linux-a11y.org wrote:
> Howdy Joanie,
> 
> i found it in this file:
> https://github.com/qt/qtbase/blob/1269f9cd16485d0081f5027ffec914bcb696f658/src/platformsupport/linuxaccessibility/bridge.cpp
>  
> 
> cheers chrys
> Zitat von Joanmarie Diggs <jdiggs@igalia.com>:
> 
> > Hey Chrys, Frederik.
> > 
> > Related question: Where are the mappings from QAccessible::Role to
> > ATK/AT-SPI2 roles? For instance, there's no such role as HelpBalloon in
> > ATK/AT-SPI2. So if that gets used, what is exposed to Orca for the role?
> > 
> > --joanie
> > 
> > On 6/6/19 9:52 AM, chrys@linux-a11y.org wrote:
> > > Howdy Joanie, Howdy Frederik,
> > > 
> > > this is an biggier issue then initial thought. There is currently no
> > > notification role for QT.
> > > would it be possible to add an temp workaround? maybe one of those?
> > > - QAccessible::ProgressBar
> > > - QAccessible::PopupMenu
> > > - QAccessible::LayeredPane
> > > - QAccessible::HelpBalloon
> > > - QAccessible::AlertMessage
> > > 
> > > https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qaccessible.html#Role-enum
> > > until we get the right role in place for next QT version? (then the
> > > workaround could be removed?)
> > > 
> > > @frederik: would you add the role "ATK:NOTIFICATION" to QT for me? we
> > > want to implement it into the new notification system.
> > > Is there an way to add an "generic API" we could use for add custom
> > > roles to the QAccessible enum? so we could use this until a bug is fixed
> > > or for very rare or custom usecases?
> > > 
> > > cheers chrys
> > > 
> > > Zitat von chrys@linux-a11y.org:
> > > 
> > > > Howdy Joanie,
> > > > 
> > > > oh this is pritty awsome! thanks for this information.
> > > > I will forward it to plasma-devel and kbroulik. fore sure they will
> > > > like your answer!
> > > > 
> > > > mercy,
> > > > 
> > > > cheers chrys
> > > > Zitat von Joanmarie Diggs <jdiggs@igalia.com>:
> > > > 
> > > > > Hey Chrys.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Regarding notifications, it should be pretty simple:
> > > > > 
> > > > > 1. Give it ROLE_NOTIFICATION
> > > > > 2. Be sure it emits an object:state-changed:showing event
> > > > > 3. Be sure the displayed text is exposed via the accessible text
> > > > > interface, either on the notification itself or in the accessible
> > > > > children of the notification
> > > > > 
> > > > > In theory, that should do it. Orca's looking for notifications that
> > > > > announce their appearance because, like you stated, they don't get
> > > > > focus.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Hope this helps. BTW, I'm not subscribed to plasma-devel, so I'm not
> > > > > sure if my CCing them will be sufficient. If it's not, and if they
> > > > > need
> > > > > what I've stated above, please forward it to them.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Thanks again for all your work on this!
> > > > > --joanie
> > > > > 
> > > > > On 6/6/19 7:45 AM, chrys@linux-a11y.org wrote:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Howdy Joanie,
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > I just give an talk to kbroulik ( the creator of Plasmas new awsome
> > > > > > notification system).
> > > > > > see here:
> > > > > > https://blog.broulik.de/2019/05/next-generation-plasma-notifications/
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > He told me that accessibility is not yet implemented. But I see
> > > > > > notifications are an very importaint part of an desktop system.
> > > > > > Problem
> > > > > > for make it accessible is, that it currently doesnt get the focus at
> > > > > > any
> > > > > > time.
> > > > > > Is there a best practice to implement this?
> > > > > > how does gnome do this? how is orca awaiting for incomming
> > > > > > notifications? do you know how we can make this happen?
> > > > > > Sorry for bother you with so basic stuff but you are the only one
> > > > > > person
> > > > > > I know what can answer those issues properly.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > maybe a nice side notice for you (and others). We currently work
> > > > > > on an
> > > > > > accessibility HIG for KDE.
> > > > > > https://hig.kde.org/accessibility/index.html
> > > > > > Still a WIP, but if someone wants to add some good content just
> > > > > > contact me.
> > > > > > It should contain:
> > > > > > - Keyboard navigation
> > > > > > - Focus handling
> > > > > > - Set A11y Lables/ Descriptions/ roles
> > > > > > - howto test for good a11y
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > cheers chrys
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > orca-list mailing list
> > > > > > orca-list@gnome.org
> > > > > > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > > > > > Orca wiki: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca
> > > > > > Orca documentation: https://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/
> > > > > > GNOME Universal Access guide:
> > > > > > https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/a11y.html
> > > > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > orca-list mailing list
> > > > orca-list@gnome.org
> > > > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
> > > > Orca wiki: https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/Orca
> > > > Orca documentation: https://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/
> > > > GNOME Universal Access guide:
> > > > https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/a11y.html
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> 
> 
> 
> 

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