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List: illumos-discuss
Subject: [discuss] =?UTF-8?B?UmU6IFtkaXNjdXNzXSBSZTogzqPPh861z4Q6IFJlOiBbZGlzY3Vzc10g?= =?UTF-8?Q?Re:_UNIX_on
From: "Guenther Alka" <alka () hfg-gmuend ! de>
Date: 2016-08-22 8:24:36
Message-ID: 54ae0d92-b730-ea91-126b-d43e79571d66 () hfg-gmuend ! de
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Unix on the desktop is a nice idea but I would never use that.
OSX and Windows or a tablet OS are specialized for that and far better.
*But one aspect remains: Server usability
*
If you manage a lot of servers, you need mainly batch jobs
but for basic tasks a GUI is enormous helpful like
- service management ex network, iscsi
- local file and snap management ex with the filebrowser and timeslider
with a remote management option like vnc
- A browser to do management tasks with a web-gui
(ex napp-it, Nexentastor, switch, router, ESXi or HA webmanagement)
If I would have the same option like on Solaris or OI where I always
prefer the "desktop" edition for a server, i would prefer this on OmniOS
as well. No "desktop apps" are needed, only system and local
filemanagement and a browser. This is also what I often hear from users
new on OmniOS. It is too hard with first steps. I always suggest them
then, do not switch to another OS, try OI or Solaris "desktop".
If I would have the choice, I would always prefer a server distribution
where such a management GUI is simply a service that I can enable or
not. The separate "desktop distribution" is obsolete. Nobody wants or
needs that and the desktop in the name indicates the wrong use case. An
additional web-based management tool can add appliance related stuff.
Gea
Am 22.08.2016 um 09:09 schrieb Dale Ghent:
> > On Aug 22, 2016, at 2:28 AM, Apostolos Syropoulos via illumos-discuss \
> > <discuss@lists.illumos.org> wrote:
> > Sumilarly, you can run your server thing on
> > virtualization just like I can run my
> > desktop on virtualization... Of course,
> > the problem here is that we are talking
> > about an OS and not about what you or me
> > like. Every OS should have a GUI.
> > Command line belongs to the middle
> > ages. This means that the leaders
> > of an OS must do everything in their
> > power to ensure that it will have a
> > GUI. I think this is not the case here.
> You're right, it's not the case here. At the same time, no one is sitting in a big \
> chair at illumos world headquarters ordering a stop to any attempt to make illumos \
> desktop a reality. That is because no such thing and no such people exist. The \
> people who do contribute a lot to illumos simply have no interest in working on \
> desktop-related tech.
> Like many OSS projects, this is a participatory meritocracy, where individual \
> people identify a need and put forth the effort - on their own initiative - to \
> realize a solution for that need and/or organize like-minded people to assist. \
> However it would be wrong to expect to make people do work that they have no \
> personal or professional interest in doing. Apache HTTPD didn't get HTTP/2 support \
> because someone at ASF commanded that it happen - a member of the community \
> realized the need for it, initiated the project, and now Apache has HTTP/2 support. \
> This is how OSS works. This is how OSS communities /should/ work.
> If someone wishes to make a project around illumos desktop and recruit people into \
> the project who can and want to code the things that need to be coded, or port the \
> things that need to be ported, and all the other aspects that would be involved - \
> that would be great and I'm sure that person would find the support if they are \
> clear in the plan and orderly in their interactions.
> My personal opinion is that OSes do not /require/ a GUI in order to be an OS, and \
> if I want a UNIX desktop for my personal needs, there are far more mature and \
> featured OSes out there that do a much better job of being a desktop OS than \
> illumos could ever be in years. But that's just my own opinion, and I respect those \
> who feel differently - but the obligation to make it happen is on them if they wish \
> for it.
-------------------------------------------
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<html><html><html><head><meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" \
http-equiv="Content-Type" /></head><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><p>Unix on \
the desktop is a nice idea but I would never use that.<br /> OSX and Windows or a \
tablet OS are specialized for that and far
better.<br /><br /><b>But one aspect remains: Server usability<br /></b><br />
If you manage a lot of servers, you need mainly batch jobs <br />
but for basic tasks a GUI is enormous helpful like<br /><br />
- service management ex network, iscsi<br />
- local file and snap management ex with the filebrowser and
timeslider<br />
with a remote management option like vnc<br />
- A browser to do management tasks with a web-gui <br />
(ex napp-it, Nexentastor, switch, router, ESXi or HA
webmanagement)<br /><br />
If I would have the same option like on Solaris or OI where I
always prefer the "desktop" edition for a server, i would prefer
this on OmniOS as well. No "desktop apps" are needed, only \
system and local filemanagement and a browser. This is also what I often
hear from users new on OmniOS. It is too hard with first steps. I
always suggest them then, do not switch to another OS, try OI or
Solaris "desktop".<br /><br />
If I would have the choice, I would always prefer a server
distribution where such a management GUI is simply a service that
I can enable or not. The separate "desktop distribution" is
obsolete. Nobody wants or needs that and the desktop in the name
indicates the wrong use case. An additional web-based management
tool can add appliance related stuff. <br /><br /><br />
Gea<br /><br /><br /><div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 22.08.2016 um 09:09 \
schrieb Dale
Ghent:<br /></div><blockquote \
cite="mid:0354F2BF-D70A-4244-A941-3CA558F5C3F2@elemental.org" type="cite"><pre \
wrap=""> </pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">On Aug 22, 2016, at 2:28 AM, \
Apostolos Syropoulos via illumos-discuss <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" \
href="mailto:discuss@lists.illumos.org"><discuss@lists.illumos.org></a> wrote:
Sumilarly, you can run your server thing on
virtualization just like I can run my
desktop on virtualization... Of course,
the problem here is that we are talking
about an OS and not about what you or me
like. Every OS should have a GUI.
Command line belongs to the middle
ages. This means that the leaders
of an OS must do everything in their
power to ensure that it will have a
GUI. I think this is not the case here.
</pre></blockquote><pre wrap="">
You're right, it's not the case here. At the same time, no one is sitting in \
a big chair at illumos world headquarters ordering a stop to any attempt to make \
illumos desktop a reality. That is because no such thing and no such people exist. \
The people who do contribute a lot to illumos simply have no interest in working on \
desktop-related tech.
Like many OSS projects, this is a participatory meritocracy, where individual people \
identify a need and put forth the effort - on their own initiative - to realize a \
solution for that need and/or organize like-minded people to assist. However it would \
be wrong to expect to make people do work that they have no personal or professional \
interest in doing. Apache HTTPD didn't get HTTP/2 support because someone at ASF \
commanded that it happen - a member of the community realized the need for it, \
initiated the project, and now Apache has HTTP/2 support. This is how OSS works. This \
is how OSS communities /should/ work.
If someone wishes to make a project around illumos desktop and recruit people into \
the project who can and want to code the things that need to be coded, or port the \
things that need to be ported, and all the other aspects that would be involved - \
that would be great and I'm sure that person would find the support if they are \
clear in the plan and orderly in their interactions.
My personal opinion is that OSes do not /require/ a GUI in order to be an OS, and if \
I want a UNIX desktop for my personal needs, there are far more mature and featured \
OSes out there that do a much better job of being a desktop OS than illumos could \
ever be in years. But that's just my own opinion, and I respect those who feel \
differently - but the obligation to make it happen is on them if they wish for it.
</pre><br /><fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset><br /><pre wrap=""><a \
class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
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