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List: gentoo-user
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Deficient Gnome Window Frames
From: gevisz <gevisz () gmail ! com>
Date: 2013-09-08 10:02:16
Message-ID: CA+t6X7fFRBC4Auh6ztKBB2_FQhr9=0Q7=fKKHtzOCNhEhuGorA () mail ! gmail ! com
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2013/9/6 Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon@gmail.com>
> On 06/09/2013 20:55, gevisz wrote:
> > 2013/9/6 gevisz <gevisz@gmail.com <mailto:gevisz@gmail.com>>
> >
> >
> > 2013/9/5 Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon@gmail.com
> > <mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com>>
> >
> > On 05/09/2013 14:51, gevisz wrote:
> > > Usually, when I open a new window frame in Gnome 2, I have a
> > Close,
> > > Maximize/Restore and Minimize buttons on its upper-right
> corner.
> > >
> > > Sometimes, however, especially when I open a supplementary
> > window frame
> > > from a running program, its upper (text) bar contains only the
> > Close
> > > button with no possibility to maximize the window frame to the
> > whole
> > > screen, and it is extremely inconvenient.
> > >
> > > I do remember that I had a similar problem in Gnome 2 under
> > Ubuntu but
> > > somehow managed to get to the configuration where almost all
> > my windows
> > > had Maximize/Restore and Minimize buttons. The only exception
> > was the
> > > Firefox sub-window to save a bookmark. :^(
> > >
> > > Just now, I have tries FXCE and found out that it opens all the
> > > sub-windows with the Maximize/Restore, Close and Minimize
> > buttons "out
> > > of the box" and without recompilation of all the programs that
> > do not do
> > > the same in Gnome (except for the Firefox bookmark sub-window,
> > of course).
> > >
> > > However, I am reluctant to migrate to FXCE right now because
> > at the
> > > moment I cannot achieve the same look-and-feel as in my Gnome
> > > (especially, I miss the the all-in-one clock-calendar-weather
> > applet
> > > with the world map showing the daytime at different locations).
> > >
> > > Could anybody advise me how to get the Close, Maximize/Restore
> and
> > > Minimize buttons in all window frames in Gnome 2.
> >
> >
> > I think the true answer is
> >
> > "You can't. The Gnome devs know better than you what you want"
> >
> > I'm happy to be proved wrong though.
> >
> > If it bothers you, just migrate to XFCE and deal with the pain.
> > It will
> > last only a short time.
> >
> > Alan McKinnon alan.mckinnon@gmail.com
> > <mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com>
> >
> >
> > Currently, Gnome works better than Xfce for me, because so far
> >
> > 1) I found no way to switch keyboard layout from English to any
> other
> > language (while Gnome and DWM do this after tackling with evdev
> > configs),
> >
> > 2) Gnome allows more combinations for hot key bindings, for example,
> > I can not assign <Win>+<Shift>+<any letter> to any program
> launcher
> > in Fxce, while it does work in Gnome,
> >
> > 3) installing Orange in FXCE involves unmasking some dependent
> > packages, but I like to stick to the stable thread.
> >
> > All in all, I do understand why Linus said that Xfce is a step back
> > compared to Gnome 2
> > (but I still have not got why Xfce is a big step forward compared
> > with Gnome 3 :^), as
> > have not tried it so far).
> >
> > P.S. I will probably post a separate question, but if somebody can
> > explain how to setup language keyboad layout switch in Fxce,
> > you are welcome. :^)
> >
> > I set up toggling the keyboard layout to <rWin> key in
> > /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf as follows:
> >
> > Option "XkbOptions"
> > "grp:rwin_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu,terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp"
> >
> > It works for Gnome and DWM but not for Xfce. :^(
> >
> > Moreover, I need the keyboard layout indicator somewhere on
> > the Xfce panel,
> > but could not find any.
> >
> >
> > A short update: after installing xfce4-xkb-plugin, which was not
> > included in the xfce4-meta package
> > (and I did not noticed it earlier), I finally got a keyboard layout
> > indicator. At first, it did not work, that is,
> > I could not switch a keyboard layout in no way. However, later, after
> > changing some of the plugin's
> > settings, it suddenly started to switch the keyboard layout.
> > Interestingly, the applet continued to switch
> > the keyboard layout even after I have changed all its settings to the
> > original ones. Magically, the <rWin>
> > key also started to switch the keyboard layout.
> >
> > So, my first and most important objection against Xfce4 is no more
> > valid. The third one is not
> > so important. Only the second is a bit annoying but one can live with
> > it. :^)
> >
> > Now, my Xfce4 looks almost like my Gnome2. Its weather applet is even
> > more informative. :^)
> >
> > However, my original question about Deficient Gnome Window Frames is
> > still valid.
> >
> > But not so important any more. :^)
>
>
> Window decorations are usually done by the window manager, I assume
> Gnome2 is no different?
>
> Have you tried running a different window manager that supports what you
> want?
> What is the Gnome2 wm anyway? Metacity? (it's been so long since I
> looked, I've forgotten)
>
Yes, the Gnome 2 window manager is Metacity.
However, I never configured my Gnome 2. :^)
I migrated to Gentoo from Ubuntu 10.04 LTS and, after mounting my old home
partition,
Gnome 2 transparently used its old configs from Ubuntu.
I think that that old Gnome 2 configs may be the reason that, at first, I
could not get
the keyboard layout switch in Fxce4.
However, now I have found all that need in Xfce4 and almost completely
satisfied with it.
The only two features that I do not like in Xfce is
1) the ugly icons of Xfce4 weather applet (Gnome 2 had much better ones)
and that
2) I can not assign <Win>+<Shift>+<any letter> to any program launcher in
Fxce4, while it does work in Gnome
>
>
> --
> Alan McKinnon
> alan.mckinnon@gmail.com
>
>
>
[Attachment #3 (text/html)]
<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">2013/9/6 Alan \
McKinnon <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com" \
target="_blank">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a>></span><br><blockquote \
class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> On 06/09/2013 20:55, gevisz wrote:<br>
> 2013/9/6 gevisz <<a href="mailto:gevisz@gmail.com">gevisz@gmail.com</a> \
<mailto:<a href="mailto:gevisz@gmail.com">gevisz@gmail.com</a>>><br> \
><br> ><br>
> 2013/9/5 Alan McKinnon <<a \
href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a><br> > \
<mailto:<a href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a>>><br>
<div><div class="h5">><br>
> On 05/09/2013 14:51, gevisz wrote:<br>
> > Usually, when I open a new window frame in Gnome 2, I have a<br>
> Close,<br>
> > Maximize/Restore and Minimize buttons on its upper-right \
corner.<br> > ><br>
> > Sometimes, however, especially when I open a supplementary<br>
> window frame<br>
> > from a running program, its upper (text) bar contains only the<br>
> Close<br>
> > button with no possibility to maximize the window frame to the<br>
> whole<br>
> > screen, and it is extremely inconvenient.<br>
> ><br>
> > I do remember that I had a similar problem in Gnome 2 under<br>
> Ubuntu but<br>
> > somehow managed to get to the configuration where almost all<br>
> my windows<br>
> > had Maximize/Restore and Minimize buttons. The only exception<br>
> was the<br>
> > Firefox sub-window to save a bookmark. :^(<br>
> ><br>
> > Just now, I have tries FXCE and found out that it opens all the<br>
> > sub-windows with the Maximize/Restore, Close and Minimize<br>
> buttons "out<br>
> > of the box" and without recompilation of all the programs \
that<br> > do not do<br>
> > the same in Gnome (except for the Firefox bookmark sub-window,<br>
> of course).<br>
> ><br>
> > However, I am reluctant to migrate to FXCE right now because<br>
> at the<br>
> > moment I cannot achieve the same look-and-feel as in my Gnome<br>
> > (especially, I miss the the all-in-one clock-calendar-weather<br>
> applet<br>
> > with the world map showing the daytime at different locations).<br>
> ><br>
> > Could anybody advise me how to get the Close, Maximize/Restore \
and<br> > > Minimize buttons in all window frames in Gnome 2.<br>
><br>
><br>
> I think the true answer is<br>
><br>
> "You can't. The Gnome devs know better than you what you \
want"<br> ><br>
> I'm happy to be proved wrong though.<br>
><br>
> If it bothers you, just migrate to XFCE and deal with the pain.<br>
> It will<br>
> last only a short time.<br>
><br>
> Alan McKinnon <a \
href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a><br> \
</div></div>> <mailto:<a \
href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a>><br> <div><div \
class="h5">><br> ><br>
> Currently, Gnome works better than Xfce for me, because so far<br>
><br>
> 1) I found no way to switch keyboard layout from English to any other<br>
> language (while Gnome and DWM do this after tackling with evdev<br>
> configs),<br>
><br>
> 2) Gnome allows more combinations for hot key bindings, for example,<br>
> I can not assign <Win>+<Shift>+<any letter> to any \
program launcher<br> > in Fxce, while it does work in Gnome,<br>
><br>
> 3) installing Orange in FXCE involves unmasking some dependent<br>
> packages, but I like to stick to the stable thread.<br>
><br>
> All in all, I do understand why Linus said that Xfce is a step back<br>
> compared to Gnome 2<br>
> (but I still have not got why Xfce is a big step forward compared<br>
> with Gnome 3 :^), as<br>
> have not tried it so far).<br>
><br>
> P.S. I will probably post a separate question, but if somebody can<br>
> explain how to setup language keyboad layout switch in Fxce,<br>
> you are welcome. :^)<br>
><br>
> I set up toggling the keyboard layout to <rWin> key in<br>
> /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/10-evdev.conf as follows:<br>
><br>
> Option "XkbOptions"<br>
> "grp:rwin_toggle,grp_led:scroll,compose:menu,terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp"<br>
><br>
> It works for Gnome and DWM but not for Xfce. :^(<br>
><br>
> Moreover, I need the keyboard layout indicator somewhere on<br>
> the Xfce panel,<br>
> but could not find any.<br>
><br>
><br>
> A short update: after installing xfce4-xkb-plugin, which was not<br>
> included in the xfce4-meta package<br>
> (and I did not noticed it earlier), I finally got a keyboard layout<br>
> indicator. At first, it did not work, that is,<br>
> I could not switch a keyboard layout in no way. However, later, after<br>
> changing some of the plugin's<br>
> settings, it suddenly started to switch the keyboard layout.<br>
> Interestingly, the applet continued to switch<br>
> the keyboard layout even after I have changed all its settings to the<br>
> original ones. Magically, the <rWin><br>
> key also started to switch the keyboard layout.<br>
><br>
> So, my first and most important objection against Xfce4 is no more<br>
> valid. The third one is not<br>
> so important. Only the second is a bit annoying but one can live with<br>
> it. :^)<br>
><br>
> Now, my Xfce4 looks almost like my Gnome2. Its weather applet is even<br>
> more informative. :^)<br>
><br>
> However, my original question about Deficient Gnome Window Frames is<br>
> still valid.<br>
><br>
> But not so important any more. :^)<br>
<br>
<br>
</div></div>Window decorations are usually done by the window manager, I assume<br>
Gnome2 is no different?<br>
<br>
Have you tried running a different window manager that supports what you<br>
want?<br>
What is the Gnome2 wm anyway? Metacity? (it's been so long since I<br>
looked, I've forgotten)<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Yes, the Gnome 2 \
window manager is Metacity.<br></div><div><br></div><div>However, I never configured \
my Gnome 2. :^)<br><br></div><div>I migrated to Gentoo from Ubuntu 10.04 LTS and, \
after mounting my old home partition,<br> </div><div>Gnome 2 transparently used its \
old configs from Ubuntu.<br><br></div><div>I think that that old Gnome 2 configs may \
be the reason that, at first, I could not get<br></div><div>the keyboard layout \
switch in Fxce4.<br> <br></div><div>However, now I have found all that need in Xfce4 \
and almost completely satisfied with it.<br><br></div><div>The only two features that \
I do not like in Xfce is<br></div><div>1) the ugly icons of Xfce4 weather applet \
(Gnome 2 had much better ones) and that<br> 2) I can not assign \
<Win>+<Shift>+<any letter> to any program launcher in Fxce4, while \
it does work in Gnome</div><div><br> <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" \
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid \
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<span class=""><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
--<br>
Alan McKinnon<br>
<a href="mailto:alan.mckinnon@gmail.com">alan.mckinnon@gmail.com</a><br>
<br>
<br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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