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List: full-disclosure
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] complaints about the governemnt spying!
From: Steve Kudlak <chromazine () sbcglobal ! net>
Date: 2005-12-31 22:18:27
Message-ID: 43B703B3.8070808 () sbcglobal ! net
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Totally Offtopic a quote from Catholic School was "The Growth of
Christianity was watered with the blood of Martyrs" yep that is what the
old Irish Nun told us. SO it is not just an Ayatollah who said it. But
anyway it would be nice if we could drift back to more technical
discusssions. I was hoping the spying thing would eventually get down to
measures and countermesaures and how one protects oneself as not all
espionage is not always by a government who at least thinks it is out of
the general good. Yeah I worked for various powers that be never in
anything real exciting, but anywaty generally that is what we thought. I
am less worried about the NSA than private detectives and others like
that. A friend once ended up being a part of a mistaken identity problem
with some bounty hunters and they made her life quite miserable for
awhile and it her a longtime to get remuneration from them for the
damage they did to her property during their "friendly little error".
Also if one works in a medium sizedf firm there is industrial espionage
and admittedly most of that like the bounty hunters and the like do
things via "social engineering" like dating the executive secretary or
chatting up someone, there still was, and probably still is a moderate
amount of electronic stuff going on. In the case of my friend they
exploited the fact that most portable phones leak and that was the
problem, the people listening could not tell which portable phone they
were listening to or so they claimed.
So I am hoping a more serious discussion would eventually start. I kind
of burn out on the "well my instructor back in 198x or 1999 said thhis
was old hat" and even more outright rumours that sound like people who
get their information from Hollywood movies that no real encryptionb
systems exist becaus they are all compromised etc. etc. etc.
Have Fun,
Sends Steve
Bob Radvanovsky wrote:
>See comments below. -rad
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dave Horsfall" <dave@horsfall.org>
>To: "Full Disclosure List" <full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk>
>Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 3:12 AM
>Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] complaints about the governemnt spying!
>
>
>
>
>>On Thu, 29 Dec 2005, Stan Bubrouski wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>>"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
>>>>safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Jefferson, 1759).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>That's actually a Benjamin Franklin quote, which is worded about 1000
>>>different ways depending on the source.
>>>
>>>
>>The above is close; the main points are "essential liberty" and "a little
>>temporary safety".
>>
>>
>
>In your example case of aphorisms, you are correct. One is from over 200
>years ago, the other less than 40.
>
>
>
>>In the meantime, perhaps some, umm, US patriot could tell me who authored
>>these particular aphorisms:
>>
>>"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of
>>patriots and tyrants."
>>
>>
>
>This was quoted from General Hummel (actor Ed Harris) from the movie, "The
>Rock", and was a paraphrased quote from Thomas Jefferson
>(http://www.monticello.org/reports/quotes/liberty.html)
>
>
>
>>"The Tree of Islam has to be watered with the blood of martyrs."
>>
>>
>
>This was quoted from the Ayatollah Khomeini in the late 70's/early 80's,
>probably just before the uprising within Iran.
>
>
>
>>I'm having trouble seeing the difference.
>>
>>-- Dave, who is not pro-US, so therefore has to be anti-US, according to
>>
>>
>Shrub
>
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
>>Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
>>Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
>Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
>Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
>
>
>
>
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<br>
Totally Offtopic a quote from Catholic School was "The Growth of
Christianity was watered with the blood of Martyrs" yep that is what
the old Irish Nun told us. SO it is not just an Ayatollah who said it.
But anyway it would be nice if we could drift back to more technical
discusssions. I was hoping the spying thing would eventually get down
to measures and countermesaures and how one protects oneself as not all
espionage is not always by a government who at least thinks it is out
of the general good. Yeah I worked for various powers that be never in
anything real exciting, but anywaty generally that is what we thought.
I am less worried about the NSA than private detectives and others like
that. A friend once ended up being a part of a mistaken identity
problem with some bounty hunters and they made her life quite miserable
for awhile and it her a longtime to get remuneration from them for the
damage they did to her property during their "friendly little error". <br>
Also if one works in a medium sizedf firm there is industrial espionage
and admittedly most of that like the bounty hunters and the like do
things via "social engineering" like dating the executive secretary or
chatting up someone, there still was, and probably still is a moderate
amount of electronic stuff going on. In the case of my friend they
exploited the fact that most portable phones leak and that was the
problem, the people listening could not tell which portable phone they
were listening to or so they claimed. <br>
<br>
So I am hoping a more serious discussion would eventually start. I kind
of burn out on the "well my instructor back in 198x or 1999 said thhis
was old hat" and even more outright rumours that sound like people who
get their information from Hollywood movies that no real encryptionb
systems exist becaus they are all compromised etc. etc. etc.<br>
<br>
Have Fun,<br>
Sends Steve<br>
<br>
<br>
Bob Radvanovsky wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid004201c60d4c$89a89440$0d09c80a@SRVR9013"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">See comments below. -rad
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Horsfall" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" \
href="mailto:dave@horsfall.org"><dave@horsfall.org></a>
To: "Full Disclosure List" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" \
href="mailto:full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk"><full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk></a>
Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 3:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] complaints about the governemnt spying!
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Thu, 29 Dec 2005, Stan Bubrouski wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Jefferson, 1759).
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">That's actually a Benjamin Franklin quote, which is worded about 1000
different ways depending on the source.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">The above is close; the main points are "essential liberty" and "a little
temporary safety".
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
In your example case of aphorisms, you are correct. One is from over 200
years ago, the other less than 40.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">In the meantime, perhaps some, umm, US patriot could tell me who authored
these particular aphorisms:
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of
patriots and tyrants."
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
This was quoted from General Hummel (actor Ed Harris) from the movie, "The
Rock", and was a paraphrased quote from Thomas Jefferson
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
href="http://www.monticello.org/reports/quotes/liberty.html">http://www.monticello.org/reports/quotes/liberty.html</a>)
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">"The Tree of Islam has to be watered with the blood of martyrs."
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
This was quoted from the Ayatollah Khomeini in the late 70's/early 80's,
probably just before the uprising within Iran.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I'm having trouble seeing the difference.
-- Dave, who is not pro-US, so therefore has to be anti-US, according to
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->Shrub
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
href="http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html">http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html</a>
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
href="http://secunia.com/">http://secunia.com/</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
_______________________________________________
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
href="http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html">http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html</a>
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" \
href="http://secunia.com/">http://secunia.com/</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>
_______________________________________________
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
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