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Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_=5F=5F[AfrICANN-discuss]=5FFadi=5FChe_had=C3=A9:=5FIf=5FWe=5FFra?= =?utf-8?Q?=3D=3Futf
From: Dr Eberhard W Lisse <el () lisse ! na>
Date: 2014-02-19 14:28:52
Message-ID: B2B945F9-81CE-4484-95AC-A4388F8A01C3 () lisse ! na
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You have not a clue of what she said. You may think you understood what someone else \
thought he understood she said.
It's rather simple, actually.
el
Sent from Dr Lisse's iPad mini
> On Feb 19, 2014, at 15:41, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep@yahoo.fr> wrote:
>
>
> The subject in question goes beyond the consideration of the simple implementation \
> of Internet exchange points (IXP).
> Few weeks ago on this mailing list and on the same subject, some demanded the \
> closing of the debate, others had said it was a nonsense. And now they want to \
> reduce or deflect the debate to the question of Internet exchange point.
> An IXP is not sufficient to resolve the issues addressed by Angela Merkel (Germany) \
> and Rousseff (Brasil)...
> --
> Pierre Lotis NANKEP
>
>
>
> Le Mercredi 19 février 2014 12h12, Dr Eberhard W Lisse <el@lisse.na> a écrit :
> Well, I speak German, and I understand Mrs Merkel to be concerned with national or \
> even European (Schengen, rather) traffic to no longer being routed via the US \
> and/or the UK, for that matter.
> I seem to understand her not having an issue with traffic to foreign destinations \
> being routed through wherever the infrastructure is fastest, cheapest, and in \
> particular not having issues with traffic to the US being routed through the US, or \
> UK traffic through the UK, as she is not (so much) concerned with the internal \
> affairs of these countries and the German constitution with its strong protection \
> of privacy (even informational privacy) doesn't apply in these cases.
> I haven't read the following, but I am absolutely certain that she has no issues \
> with traffic from the US, UK or foreign countries to the US, UK or foreign \
> countries being routed through European infrastructure, in particular if German \
> Intelligence service can deeply inspect the traffic.
> So, what we are talking here is nothing but Internet Exchanges. Even if it is clear \
> from the language she uses that she doesn't understand the finer points.
> Though she clearly understands that there are voters who don't want their traffic \
> to be read.
> Even former MPs and (subsequently former) Interior Ministers..
>
> el
>
> Sent from Dr Lisse's iPad mini
>
> > On Feb 19, 2014, at 12:02, Kivuva <Kivuva@transworldafrica.com> wrote:
> >
> > What Merkel is talking about is very similar to Rousseff's a year ago.
> >
> > It has been debated before that balkanising the internet is no remedy to security \
> > problems and spying.
> > Regards
> >
> > ______________________
> > Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya.
> > twitter.com/lordmwesh
> > google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh
> >
> >
> > On 18 February 2014 13:03, gandji francine <gandjif@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > +1
> >
> > Francine GANDJI
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 9:25 PM, bouba <djamaab@yahoo.fr> wrote:
> > Interesting;
> >
> > We africans it is better for us to stop bickering ourselves; lets consider this \
> > possibility and above all prepare ourselves firmly on any event/future of \
> > Internet in order to exist and influence the debate instead of being followers.
> > ----
> > Djamaa BOUBA
> >
> >
> > Le Mardi 18 février 2014 20h35, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <lnankep@yahoo.fr> a écrit \
> > : Let us discuss again the fragmentation of the Internet. Do not be afraid to \
> > face the reality of the future ...
> > Where are our Internet Activists, and Fellowshippers?
> > What are your opinions on the current and upcoming developments?
> >
> > Happy reading :
> > http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26210053
> > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/02/17/angela_merkel_eu_internet_nsa_us/
> > http://www.france24.com/fr/20140217-angela-merkel-nsa-internet-europeen-espionnage-protection-donnees-personnelles-espionnage/
> > Whether you want it or not, future generations will not know the Internet as it \
> > exists today. Anyway, enjoy the anarchic freedom that gives us the Internet today \
> > before things normalize.
> > --
> > Pierre Lotis NANKEP
> >
> >
> >
> > Le Jeudi 6 février 2014 6h04, Mukom Akong T. <mukom.tamon@gmail.com> a écrit :
> >
> >
> > > On 5 February 2014 16:28, Ben Akoh <me@benakoh.com> wrote:
> > > What is this deep seated desire to close dialogues? Where does it come from? It \
> > > defies the very nature of Africans - our cultural fundamentals to dialogue \
> > > until a resolution is reached, until out hearts' content. It violates the \
> > > freedom of speech that we all subscribe to. Totally against our being. A \
> > > dialogue, any dialogue should continue until we are satisfied. There are no \
> > > gate keepers in traditional African dialogue settings. If you wish not to \
> > > participate, just play the lurker. That is some form of expression too.
> >
> > +1 Ben. Defending an open Internet by not tolerating discussion about an open \
> > Internet. What an incredible demonstration on openness!!
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > AfrICANN mailing list
> > AfrICANN@afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > AfrICANN mailing list
> > AfrICANN@afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > AfrICANN mailing list
> > AfrICANN@afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > AfrICANN mailing list
> > AfrICANN@afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > AfrICANN mailing list
> > AfrICANN@afrinic.net
> > https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo.cgi/africann
>
> _______________________________________________
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<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; \
charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>You have not a clue of what she said. You \
may think you understood what someone else thought he understood she \
said.</div><div><br></div><div>It's rather simple, \
actually.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>el</div><div><br></div><div><br>Sent \
from Dr Lisse's iPad mini</div><div><br>On Feb 19, 2014, at 15:41, Pierre Lotis \
NANKEP <<a href="mailto:lnankep@yahoo.fr">lnankep@yahoo.fr</a>> \
wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div style="color:#000; \
background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, \
Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt"><br>The subject in question goes beyond the \
consideration of the simple implementation of Internet exchange points \
(IXP).<div><br><span id="result_box" class="" lang="en"><span class="hps">Few weeks \
ago</span> <span class="hps">on this</span> mailing list <span class="hps">and</span> \
<span class="hps">on the same subject</span><span>, some</span> <span \
class="hps">demanded</span> <span class="hps">the closing of the</span> <span \
class="hps">debate</span><span class="">, others had</span> <span class="hps">said it \
was</span> <span class="hps">a</span> <span class="hps">nonsense</span><span>.</span> \
<span class="hps">And now</span> <span class="hps">they want to reduce</span> <span \
class="hps">or</span> <span class="hps">deflect</span> <span class="hps">the \
debate</span> <span class="hps">to the question of</span> <span class="hps">Internet \
exchange point</span><span class="">.</span></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, \
0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica \
Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; \
font-style: normal;"><br><span id="result_box" class="" lang="en"><span \
class=""></span></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; \
font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; \
background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;">An IXP is not sufficient to \
resolve the issues addressed by Angela Merkel (Germany) and Rousseff (Brasil)<span \
id="result_box" class="" lang="en"><span \
class="">...<br></span></span></div><div> </div><div>-- <br>Pierre Lotis NANKEP \
<br><br></div><div style="display: block;" class="yahoo_quoted"> <br> <br> <div \
style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, \
sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica \
Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> \
<font face="Arial" size="2"> Le Mercredi 19 février 2014 12h12, Dr Eberhard W Lisse \
<<a href="mailto:el@lisse.na">el@lisse.na</a>> a écrit :<br> </font> </div> \
<div class="y_msg_container"><div id="yiv6997894772"><div><div>Well, I speak German, \
and I understand Mrs Merkel to be concerned with national or even European (Schengen, \
rather) traffic to no longer being routed via the US and/or the UK, for that \
matter. </div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>I seem to understand her not \
having an issue with traffic to foreign destinations being routed through wherever \
the infrastructure is fastest, cheapest, and in particular not having issues with \
traffic to the US being routed through the US, or UK traffic through the UK, as she \
is not (so much) concerned with the internal affairs of these countries and the \
German constitution with its strong protection of privacy (even informational \
privacy) doesn't apply in these cases. </div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>I \
haven't read the following, but I am absolutely certain that she has no issues with \
traffic from the US, UK or foreign countries to the US, UK or foreign countries being \
routed through European infrastructure, in particular if German Intelligence service \
can deeply inspect the traffic.</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>So, what we are \
talking here is nothing but Internet Exchanges. Even if it is clear from the language \
she uses that she doesn't understand the finer points. </div><div><br \
clear="none"></div><div>Though she clearly understands that there are voters who \
don't want their traffic to be read.</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>Even \
former MPs and (subsequently former) Interior Ministers..</div><div><br \
clear="none"></div><div>el</div><div><br clear="none">Sent from Dr Lisse's iPad \
mini</div><div class="yiv6997894772yqt2217123789" id="yiv6997894772yqt36367"><div><br \
clear="none">On Feb 19, 2014, at 12:02, Kivuva <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" \
ymailto="mailto:Kivuva@transworldafrica.com" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:Kivuva@transworldafrica.com">Kivuva@transworldafrica.com</a>> \
wrote:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div \
dir="ltr">What Merkel is talking about is very similar to Rousseff's a year \
ago.<div><br clear="none"></div><div>It has been debated before that balkanising the \
internet is no remedy to security problems and spying. </div><div>
<br clear="none"></div><div>Regards</div></div><div \
class="yiv6997894772gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div \
dir="ltr">______________________<br clear="none">Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya.<br \
clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" \
href="http://twitter.com/lordmwesh">twitter.com/lordmwesh</a><br clear="none">
<div>google ID | Skype ID: lordmwesh</div></div></div>
<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div class="yiv6997894772gmail_quote">On 18 \
February 2014 13:03, gandji francine <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" \
shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:gandjif@yahoo.com" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:gandjif@yahoo.com">gandjif@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br \
clear="none"><blockquote class="yiv6997894772gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 \
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div><div style="font-size:10pt;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, \
Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;"><div><span>+1</span></div><span \
class="yiv6997894772HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"></font></span><div \
style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:HelveticaNeue, \
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;">
<span><br clear="none"></span></div><div \
style="font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent;font-family:HelveticaNeue, \
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;"><span>Francine \
GANDJI</span></div>
<div><div class="yiv6997894772h5"><div style="display:block;"> <br clear="none"> <br \
clear="none"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, \
Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;font-size:10pt;"> <div \
style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida \
Grande', sans-serif;font-size:12pt;">
<div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 9:25 PM, bouba \
<<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:djamaab@yahoo.fr" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:djamaab@yahoo.fr">djamaab@yahoo.fr</a>> wrote:<br clear="none"> \
</font> </div> <div><div><div><div style="font-size:12pt;font-family:HelveticaNeue, \
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;">
<div><span>Interesting;</span></div><div \
style="font-style:normal;font-size:16px;background-color:transparent;font-family:HelveticaNeue, \
'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;"><span lang="en"><br \
clear="none">
W<span>e</span> <span>africans it is better for us to stop </span></span><span \
lang="en"><span></span><span></span><span></span><span>bickering ourselves; lets \
consider </span><span>this possibility</span> <span>and above all</span> \
<span>prepare ourselves</span> <span>firmly on</span> <span>any</span> \
<span>event</span>/future of Internet <span>in order to exist</span> <span>and \
influence</span> <span>the debate</span> <span>instead of</span> <span>being \
followers.</span></span></div>
<div> </div><div><font>----<br clear="none">Djamaa BOUBA<br \
clear="none"></font></div><div style="display:block;"> <br clear="none"> <br \
clear="none"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, \
Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;font-size:12pt;">
<div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida \
Grande', sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> Le Mardi 18 \
février 2014 20h35, Pierre Lotis NANKEP <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" \
ymailto="mailto:lnankep@yahoo.fr" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:lnankep@yahoo.fr">lnankep@yahoo.fr</a>> a écrit :<br clear="none">
</font> </div> <div><div><div><div><div \
style="font-size:10pt;font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, \
'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;">Let us discuss again the fragmentation of the Internet. \
<span lang="en"><span>Do</span> <span>not be afraid</span> <span>to face the \
reality</span> <span>of the future
...</span></span><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Where are our Internet Activists, \
and Fellowshippers?<br clear="none">What are your opinions on the current and \
upcoming developments?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">
Happy reading :<br clear="none"><ol dir="ltr"><li><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" \
target="_blank" href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26210053">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26210053</a></li><li><a \
rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" \
href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/02/17/angela_merkel_eu_internet_nsa_us/">http: \
//www.theregister.co.uk/2014/02/17/angela_merkel_eu_internet_nsa_us/</a></li><li><a \
rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" \
href="http://www.france24.com/fr/20140217-angela-merkel-nsa-internet-europeen-espionna \
ge-protection-donnees-personnelles-espionnage/">http://www.france24.com/fr/20140217-an \
gela-merkel-nsa-internet-europeen-espionnage-protection-donnees-personnelles-espionnage/</a></li></ol><div><span \
lang="en"><span>Whether you</span> <span>want it</span> <span>or not,</span> \
<span>future generations</span> <span>will not know</span> <span>the</span> \
<span>Internet</span> <span>as</span> <span>it exists today.</span> \
<span>Anyway</span><span>,</span> <span>enjoy</span> <span>the</span> \
<span>anarchic</span> <span>freedom</span> <span>that</span> <span>gives us \
the</span> <span>Internet</span> <span>today</span> <span>before</span> \
<span>things</span> <span>normalize</span><span>.</span></span></div>
<div> </div><div>--
<br clear="none">Pierre Lotis NANKEP
<br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div style="display:block;"> <br \
clear="none"> <br clear="none"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica \
Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;font-size:10pt;">
<div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida \
Grande', sans-serif;font-size:12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> Le Jeudi 6 \
février 2014 6h04, Mukom Akong T. <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" \
ymailto="mailto:mukom.tamon@gmail.com" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:mukom.tamon@gmail.com">mukom.tamon@gmail.com</a>> a écrit :<br \
clear="none">
</font> </div> <div><div><div><div><div><br clear="none"></div><div><br \
clear="none"></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><div>On 5 February 2014 16:28, \
Ben Akoh <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" \
ymailto="mailto:me@benakoh.com" target="_blank" \
href="mailto:me@benakoh.com">me@benakoh.com</a>></span> wrote:<br clear="none">
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc \
solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div><div>What is this deep seated desire to close \
dialogues? Where does it come from? It defies the very nature of Africans - our \
cultural fundamentals to dialogue until a resolution is reached, until out hearts' \
content. It violates the freedom of speech that we all subscribe to. Totally against \
our being. A dialogue, any dialogue should continue until we are satisfied. There are \
no gate keepers in traditional African dialogue settings. If you wish not to \
participate, just play the lurker. That is some form of expression too. </div>
</div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br clear="none"></div><div>+1 \
Ben. Defending an open Internet by not tolerating discussion about an open Internet. \
What an incredible demonstration on openness!!</div>
<div><br clear="none"></div></div></div></div><br \
clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">AfrICANN \
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clear="none">
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